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I am preparing to overhaul my HT system and had been leaning toward the Denon AVR-4802 receiver. However, I have only recently heard about the Rotel RSX-1065 and understand that it too is an excellent A/V receiver. Whichever one I buy will be driving B&W loudspeakers. I am looking for comparative comments. Tell me what you think.Thanks......Peter
Follow Ups:
I own a 4802. I don't find the remote "horrible." In fact, my wife is quite happy with it as she can operate the entire system from a single remote - and has no trouble doing it. She is quite happy to not have to try and guess which remote operates which piece of equipment. The menu system on the remote is really quite straight forward and not hard to use. It is a learning remote and I have had no problems programming additional equipment and features into it.As far as the difference between the 4802 and 5803, the 5803 has a LOT more features that I determined I would never use - and 40 more Watts per channel when used in surround configuration.
The surround decoding section is very, very good and the system gives you a setup parameters to tweak to your heart's content. The only thing I don't like is the single transformer feeding all channels. I found with my N802's that at THX listening levels, the sound would lose some of the dynamics during sustained loud passages. It would never distort or sound harsh, the sound would just become a bit compressed. All I could figure was the transformer could not recharge the output caps totally during the "loud" period and the N802's want LOTS of current.
I solved the problem by using a VK6200 for the amp and just using the 4802 as a pre-amp. Totally satisfactory as the decoding section and pre-amp are very good, especially when using the "pure direct" mode for stereo only listening.
Well, you're in a very select group that finds the Atkis remote non-horrible. BTW, don't drop the remote or crack the screen (easy to do) - it's not covered under the 4802's warranty and I've heard many horror stories regarding attempts to get it repaired and/or replaced.As you discovered, the 4802's amps, while competent, are nothing to write home about. Like you, many other 4802 owners eventually end up using it a pre/pro.
So, to recap you spent around $2000 for a mid-fi receiver and still had to throw some more bucks into it for proper amplification. Now compare the 3802 and the 4802 in "pre/pro" mode. I think might agree that at around $700, the 3802 would have been a better buy.
Austin
"I own a 4802. I don't find the remote "horrible." In fact, my wife is quite happy with it as she can operate the entire system from a single remote - and has no trouble doing it. She is quite happy to not have to try and guess which remote operates which piece of equipment. The menu system on the remote is really quite straight forward and not hard to use. It is a learning remote and I have had no problems programming additional equipment and features into it."
...I dropped the remote on the corner of a table & cracked the screen. It was replaced for a $15.00 shipping charge and the new one had upgraded software. You may not like the remote - that's your choice. I've never had anyone spend more than 1-2 minutes playing with it before they understood how it worked. Seems really simple to me and at least 5 other people.You select the device from the left hand menu. The device controls come up on the screen and you control the device. To control another device, you select it from the left hand menu. Device comes up, etc. On those devices (like the receiver) that have more controls than can be displayed on 1 page, you use either the joy stick or the arrows at the top of the menu page to access the next page.
This is difficult?? Wow! Like the recipe for ice cubes, maybe?
No, actually the 3802, for my use, would NOT have been a better buy as the the 3802 did not have THX processing and that WONDERFUL remote.
Also, I do use the amp section of the 4802 to drive 2 separate zones of outdoor speakers, which I can do independently with this receiver. So really, I'm quite happy with the choice. I'm also sure that with different speakers (not quite so current hungry), the receiver would have been just fine. I have a friend with the 3802 driving Klipsh and it works/sounds fine for his use.
So, let's get this straight - you don't own a 4802, hate the remote, but feel you need to comment on my uses of equipment & choice on how to spend MY money? Hmmmmm....my how arrogant of you.
Don't own one - used to but "downgraded" to 3802 and bought an amp with the difference.Different strokes on the remote - I'll remember your replacement story for reference to owners that have had problems.
THX post wasn't critical for me - I agree some people find it desirable for optimum HT.
As far as dollars, you get 95% of the performance of the 4802 (in pre/pro mode) at much less than 50% of its price by using the 3802. You, as is your right, appear to place a very high value on THX post-processing (around $1,300 to be precise). Your choice.
Peter,The sub-flagships are generally a losing proposition. They are priced way up there with their big brothers, yet don't have the features or model recognition (and therefore resale value) of the flagships. The 4802 is precisely in this predicament.
If you're not prepared to go flaship (at $2,500-$3,000), I'd recommend adopting a short-term "modified" separates strategy. Depending on your need for video up/side conversion, get either the Denon 3803 ($800-$900) or the previous model, the 3802 ($600-$700). Pair it up with nice 5-ch or 7-ch or 5+2-ch outboard amps and you shoud be good to go.
Actually, good to wait
! When the nexgen porcessors arrive supporting digital interfaces to hirez audio, snap up the pre/pro or receiver of your choice. Hook up your amps and enjoy! Another nice benefit of this setup is it allows you to readily swap in pre/pros and receivers to evaluate their contribution to your overall HT. As you see, careful selection of your amps is critical as you will be keeping them for the forseeable future. Make sure they match well with your speakers, can be accomodated in your racking and are triggerable (if needed). You also might consider whether they run hot, have clip indicators, balanced and RCA connectors, decent speakers posts, transferrable warrranties, etc., etc.
Good luck.
Austin
What 5ch or 7ch do you recommend with the denon 3803? Thinking of this as the base for future upgrades, so I don't want to aim too low. Life is short and $1,000 bills for entertainment electronics only come around once in a while. I'd like to get it right the first time.
How about a list of features to recommend? Digital Hires? How far away is it?
WH,Depends where you want to go. Multichannel hirez music (5.1), full tilt HT (6.1/7.1), optimum stereo (dedicated 2-ch amp/pass through pre), a combination? What are you willing to compromise?
Depends how fast you want to get there. If today, grab Pioneer's 47Ai universal and its 49TXi receiver. You're as good as it gets wrt DVD-Audio but SACD is down(side)-converted to 88.2/32 PCM in the 49TXi. If you have a couple years, lighten up on the source and processing dollars and put them into components with legs - amps, speakers, cables, furniture and software.
Depends on the resources you intend to apply to the journey. There is not currently a SOTA solution to the HT/Hirez problem at ANY price. There will be solutions (both high-end and mid-fi) within the next year.
You got to know what you want to get what you need. Good luck.
Austin
Austin:I am sure you are well informed and that your comments have merit, but I was hoping for some feedback regarding the comparative strengths and weaknesses of the 2 receivers mentioned.
Peter
Peter,Both the Denon and the Rotel are competent receivers. The 4802, with which I have a good deal of familiarity, is a step up from the 1065. More channels, bigger & better amps, cleaner sound. The 4802 has a horrible remote, the Atkis 8000. Neither of the units provide bass management on the analog inputs, so an ICBM or BM'd player is in order for hirez audio. One nice thing about the Denon is the alternate speaker setup. You can wire both dipole and direct rad side surrounds. They will be switched automatically depending on source. This is very handy for HT/hirez multi-channel.
As I said in my previous post, I really wouldn't recommend the 4802 at this time but between the two you are considering, I'd go with the Denon. Best of luck with your new setup.
Austin
Peter,It is a difficult decesion to make. I to had to make a choice. Both are great products. You cannot go wrong. As Austin mentioned, it has many more bells and whistles...more features. Ask yourself this question: Can I afford the the denon which is more expensive: or does it fit in my buget? If yes is your answer, then proceed and purchase the avr 4802. In the end I to , chose the Denon avr 4802. I have no regrets. Actually, I was also interested in the processor by rotel rsp 1066. good luck.
Andrew
Austin:You seem to have some good ideas, but try to understand that I am closer to novice than expert. Since I'm not looking to create the ultimate system, it would seem better if I kept things simple and straight forward. That said, I think I'll go with the 4802. I'm confident it'll be a good choice, and I'll be happy. But I appreciate your advice.
Thanks........Peter
Peter,
If you are a novice - STOP! Do not pass go - do not spend $2000 on a receiver that is at the same time both obsolete and over the top for your needs.I don't think twice about holding my tongue when I see a novice blowing $500 on their first foray into HT - they'll learn and half a grand's a reasonable price of admission.
But the kind of bucks you're talking about calls for a bit of guidance from someone who's been there. Please re-read my posts on this topic. Then, as you've started to do already, continue posting on the HT boards where you can get a much better grounding than on an audiophile board which necessarily caters to high-end audio (which HT is definitely NOT!). Research, discuss, and audition. Repeat until you gain the confidence to proceed.
The fewer preconceived notions you go into this process with, the better result you will come out of it with. The alternative is a great deal of wasted time and money with EXACTLY the same end result.
Best of luck and I hope you enjoy the journey.
Austin
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