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BD player 7.1 analog out...

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Newbie question:
When connecting the analog out to the DSP/AVR input, does the volume adjustments for each channel occur in the digital domain or is it analog?

Follow Ups:

RE: BD player 7.1 analog out...bluray.com - Ben Van Dyk 10:09:49 11/22/09 (1)
has a lot of info about bd players.I went there first before buying my player.some older models need upgrades.the newer wons can do it by internet. kind of a pain they said they should of waited a year to introduce the players.I wanted an older model that plays dvd audio.it did not have internet uploading capabilities.no bd discs would play in it so I called the manufacture to send me an upgrade disc.it fixed it.I think the newer ones have the upgrades installed.they should be plug&play
dvd audio & multichannel sacds rule
- Much appreciate all the help from you folks. - wheezer 10:41:20 11/22/09 (0)
  Thanks again.Yet another good link.
  This forum, which I my first time visiting is really great.
  Unlike others... Speaker and PC, most have their noses stuck where the sun don't shine.
  Much appreciate all the help from you folks.
RE: BD player 7.1 analog out... - cfraser 09:19:58 11/22/09 (15)
Hi Mitch, according to the service manual for your AVR, the direct analog inputs do not use any DSP features...so I guess that means they're adjusted in the analog domain. (In fact, the direct analog inputs are used as part of a procedure to determine right at the start if you have a DSP/digital or analog problem.)
- your emails are bouncing back..schokttky's - wheezer 18:05:52 11/22/09 (0)
  Schottky's
  
  http://search.digikey.com/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?WT.z_header=search_go&lang=en&site=us&keywords=11dq10&x=0&y=0
  
  http://search.digikey.com/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?WT.z_header=search_go&lang=en&site=us&keywords=31dq10&x=0&y=0
- Has anybody build a regulated linear power supply for the Oppo.... - wheezer 15:13:38 11/22/09 (4)
  I see it comes with a switching PS?
  If not I have no problem being the first. :-))
  - Theta has - cfraser 15:43:02 11/22/09 (3)
    I think Ayre is doing it?? I bet Modwright has thought of it, if not actually doing it...
    I don't seriously use the analog outputs, I'd be more concerned if I did. Not that I don't think a nice linear supply wouldn't help the digital stuff...we'll see how things go when my warranty is up. BTW, the BDP-83 made my BP AC supply make some strange noises...never encountered anything like it before...something "unusual" with Oppo's switching supply input??
    Edit: found my file splitter, will email manual and program...
    
    Edits: 11/22/09 11/22/09
    - RE: Theta has - wheezer 16:41:31 11/22/09 (2)
      Check you mains voltage.
      Check for DC.
      ANY audio/video device will benefit from a linear reg'd PS.
      Why wait till the warranty is up. Just swap the DIY PS for the switcher.
      - RE: Theta has - cfraser 16:53:10 11/22/09 (1)
        
        In Reply to: RE: Theta has posted by wheezer on November 22, 2009 at 16:41:31
        
        The BDP-83 is already "good enough" for HDMI use as it is. I really don't see/hear any obvious flaws of its making, I mean of the type that annoy me. I am long past the point of looking for (my idea of) perfection. Manufacturers sell a new version of "perfection" every time they have a new model. I have settled for a version that means "pleasant enough", gives me a lot more time to use the damn gear :)
        The downside to not modding is I spend way more $$$ consuming media than I did when just dicking around with stuff. But when something needs attention to be acceptable to me, and already shows promise, then I'm game. For instance my HDMI pre-pro needs some attention...
        Edit: hmmm, so you think the Oppo could be leaking some DC on the high side? You know, it did kind of sound like that... I have also heard a similar noise at somebody else's house when they had a switching supply that assymetrically loaded the transformers (I forget how). I have plugged tons of different stuff into my BP and never heard this before, I think the Oppo was only consuming 18W at the time. Anyway, it looks fine enough with regular power.
        And again: you know that DAC we were talking about? Many people MUCH prefer it with a switching supply over linear or battery. I have one DAC that I can't stand the sound of it with battery power, I much prefer linear. So power preference does vary with circumstance. Geez, this thread is all over the place...
        
        Edits: 11/22/09 11/22/09
        
        RE: Theta has - wheezer 17:14:02 11/22/09 (0)
        
        In Reply to: RE: Theta has posted by cfraser on November 22, 2009 at 16:53:10
        
        I have several 12V Switchers, I should give them a try with the DDDAC.
        I may put the single tower together tonight. Ya got my on a roll.:-)
        The steroids do help:-)
- Yet one more dumb question... - wheezer 10:45:57 11/22/09 (2)
  Can the usb port be used for HDD playback into the BDP, for example, movies loaded on the HDD?
  - RE: Yet one more dumb question... - cfraser 13:16:46 11/22/09 (1)
    Not a dumb Q. Yes you can play back, but results depend how the content is containerised and formatted. Can only use FAT32 USB drive format also. Limitations for audio files too, like no WMA Pro etc.
    
    Re the 520 manual: I don't know where to put it. Current ISP only allows 5MB upload space and manual is a lot bigger. Are you sure you don't have it somewhere? You did once, we were discussing something in it before you bought...I got this off a PC I used "two ago" (didn't salvage anything off last PC)...think around 2001/2 if you keep old PCs.
    - RE: Yet one more dumb question... - wheezer 15:10:38 11/22/09 (0)
      I have the owner's manual; not the SM.:-(
- Any way to test the AVR's input )output with a signal gen. and Oscope? (nt) - wheezer 09:48:36 11/22/09 (0)
- RE: BD player 7.1 analog out...mac mini - wheezer 09:46:32 11/22/09 (4)
  Craig hi,
  So, that means I would go straight mch out from the Oppo to the HK520 analog input, regardless of DVD or BD?
  Amazing, all my questions and an education on DVD and BDP in one thread.
  Also, I've been beating my head trying to get my mac mini 1.66 core duo, to play DVD's and it just can't handle it. Jumpy picture; with some add-ons and tweaks it's gotten to look like streaming video, and won't fill the screen unless I go VGA, which ain't all that great.
  Will the Oppo do 24P, 30P etc?
  Set screen sizes to fit or something like that without overscan?
  I know you have one, which means it's fine for me. Just need the funds.
  Thank you,
  Regards,
  Mitch
  - RE: BD player 7.1 analog out...mac mini - cfraser 10:06:30 11/22/09 (3)
    When I said "direct analog inputs" above, I meant the mch ones that HK calls "Direct"...just to clarify what I said in case you thought it meant ALL analog inputs.
    Yes re the scope etc.; that is in fact how the initial test in the SM I mentioned is outlined. They suggest a 0dB input (~0.775V IIRC)and hooking the scope on the speaker outputs (no speakers), volume at -25 to -40 typical.
    Yes you'd hook the mch player outputs to the "direct" AVR inputs. Bass management is done in the player, so nice to get one with a few options there if possible.
    I got the Oppo BDP-83 mainly for DVD. Everything else it doesn't do any better than other players I have [edit: correction, the 83 upscales non-1080p BD content, which my PS3 doesn't do, so that's "better"...you referred to non-1080p BD content elsewhere]. Via HDMI I mean. It's 2ch analog output is better than my other BD/DVD players, but isn't that great IMO...usable, and I rarely use the analog outs anyway. Yes, it does 24fps for film (BD or DVD) if desired, and 30fps for video.
    Edit: I have very little experience using mch analog outputs. I did use them with a Panny DVDP I had, for DVD-A, but don't remember it much. I am pretty sure the Oppo mch outputs would be plenty fine for movies...
    
    Edits: 11/22/09 11/22/09
    - RE: BD player 7.1 analog out...mac mini - wheezer 10:30:25 11/22/09 (2)
      Yes re the scope etc.; that is in fact how the initial test in the SM I mentioned is outlined. They suggest a 0dB input (~0.775V IIRC)and hooking the scope on the speaker outputs (no speakers), volume at -25 to -40 typical.
      Do you have that section of the SM?
      I assume the typical sweep method, 8ohm R across the speaker outs.
      Crank up the sig. gen to 1KHz. and one should get the same 1KHz/ 0.775V or -3db out?
      Or, would that be at the Pre-outs?
      BTW, I've not used the internal amps in years. fronts get tubes.
      Rears and center get the Rotel RB930ax, highly modified by, yours truly and kicks ass over the internal amps.
      I've thought about upgrdes to the HK 520, PS caps and Schottky's but they appear to a royal PITFA to gain access.
      - RE: BD player 7.1 analog out...mac mini - cfraser 10:40:47 11/22/09 (1)
        
        In Reply to: RE: BD player 7.1 analog out...mac mini posted by wheezer on November 22, 2009 at 10:30:25
        
        They don't mention output levels nor input frequency, 1kHz sounds good. Yes you can measure at preamp outputs (though this is the 520 manual, this section seems written for some models that may not have pre outs) instead of (unloaded) speaker outputs.
        
        These manuals used to be on the HK site. Maybe look around elsewhere. I downloaded this one years ago when you were thinking of getting the 520...it's not like I have one. LOL. Now I have no way to get it to you because I can't email such large docs anymore.
        
        Can you upload the SM to a link so I can download it? (nt) - wheezer 10:42:54 11/22/09 (0)
        
        In Reply to: RE: BD player 7.1 analog out...mac mini posted by cfraser on November 22, 2009 at 10:40:47
RE: BD player 7.1 analog out... - Ben Van Dyk 10:30:38 11/20/09 (15)
if the bd player can play dvd audio or sacd.if not use the digital.the player need 2 sets of front analog if you want to have both hooked up.1 for the dvd & one for the mch input.dvd will be digital & mch analog volume.if your playing bd discs Id use the digital playback.
dvd audio & multichannel sacds rule
- Actually I'm researching BD players, to suit my needs... - wheezer 15:17:44 11/20/09 (14)
  I don't need DVD-A or SACD. I use a mac mini > USB DDDAC 16 bit NOS.
  I do want very good video playback, for both BD and upconverting DVD > Samsung LN52B750.
  All suggestions welcome especially from those who have done shootouts.:-)
  - RE: Actually I'm researching BD players, to suit my needs... - audio_d 00:25:54 11/21/09 (0)
    Some great sounding, affordable BDPs;
    
    Panasonic DMP-BD80
    
    Sony BDP-S760
  - RE: Actually I'm researching BD players, to suit my needs... - Ben Van Dyk 22:31:38 11/20/09 (12)
    I dont know what that dac is for but if you want to use it on a blu ray players digital out.there is no upconversion available.it uses the hdmi out for that.any way the new oppo bd player upconverts dvd but its a universal player.good luck on finding what you want.you could try typing in upconverting bd players on your home page.maybe all the brand names do it.
    dvd audio & multichannel sacds rule
    - Sorry for the confusion... I won't be using DVD-A or SACD... - wheezer 09:10:08 11/21/09 (11)
      Hi BVD,
      My stereo 16bit NOS USB dac..... mac mini > usb dac > preamp. I'm all set with my stereo playback system.
      I'm looking for a BDP (hdmi digital out) that does video playback, upconverting excellent. If, it must come with other caveats....so be it.
      Point being, I can't see buying the Oppo for 500bucks as "universal" A/V unit. I've already got a top notch digital stereo playback setup.
      If, the Oppo is the king of video playback and upconversion, then I'll consider biting the bullet. I'd think there are other BDP with less bells and whistles that do video equally as well...I'm making an assUmption here.:-)
      Regards,
      Mitch
      - several options - Joe Murphy Jr 16:15:47 11/21/09 (9)
        
        In Reply to: RE: Sorry for the confusion... I won't be using DVD-A or SACD... posted by wheezer on November 21, 2009 at 09:10:08
        
        Via HDMI, most of the Blu-ray players are very close for Blu-ray playback. The oppo adds what is probably the best deinterlacing for DVDs and 1080i Blu-ray discs. If you don't want to spend the $500 on the oppo and want a capable, yet inexpensive stand-alone player, the Panasonics (BD-35, BD-60) do quite well. If you want the capability to do a hell of a lot more for $300, the PS3 is an awesome device.
        
        RE: several options - wheezer 09:39:51 11/22/09 (3)
        
        In Reply to: RE: several options posted by Joe Murphy Jr on November 21, 2009 at 16:15:47
        
        I had thought all BD's are 1080P.
        Boy am I green on this topic....gimmy some tubes.:-)
        
        format - Joe Murphy Jr 13:33:43 11/22/09 (2)
        
        In Reply to: RE: several options posted by wheezer on November 22, 2009 at 09:39:51
        
        Blu-ray movies are usually released in the 1080p24 format. Blu-ray concerts are usually released in the 1080i60 format, but there are some concerts which have been released in 1080p24.
        
        The 1080p24 format gives the disc a film-like appearance. The 1080i60 format gives the disc a more "live" appearance.
        
        RE: format - wheezer 15:20:05 11/22/09 (0)
        
        In Reply to: RE: format posted by Joe Murphy Jr on November 22, 2009 at 13:33:43
        
        Hi Joe,
        
        I've read about 30fps, is that something that is currently used?
        
        Thanks,
        Mitch
        
        RE: format - wheezer 15:11:24 11/22/09 (0)
        
        In Reply to: RE: format posted by Joe Murphy Jr on November 22, 2009 at 13:33:43
        
        Ah, yet more info I was clueless to.
        Thanks.
        
        RE: several options - wheezer 23:00:58 11/21/09 (4)
        
        In Reply to: RE: several options posted by Joe Murphy Jr on November 21, 2009 at 16:15:47
        
        Joe hi,
        I've looked at those BDP and entry level isn't where I'd like to go.
        My Samsung LCD flat panel does all the online stuff,so a non-issue.
        Will the Oppo provide more video setting options(varying fps) than these players, as well as better video performance (aside the deinterlacing you mentioned)
        Not opposed to spending the bucks, but want to make sure I don't sell myself short either.
        I see the digital audio output formats are different:
        Oppo supports Dolby Digital, Dolby Digital Plus, Dolby TrueHD,etc. How will the lower tiered BDP, not supporting DD, DDP, same for DTS's, treat audio/digital playback from a standard DVD? I have a large collection of DVD's and will start getting into BD.
        Regards,
        Mitch
        
        support - Joe Murphy Jr 07:29:13 11/22/09 (3)
        
        In Reply to: RE: several options posted by wheezer on November 21, 2009 at 23:00:58
        
        "How will the lower tiered BDP, not supporting DD, DDP, same for DTS's, treat audio/digital playback from a standard DVD?"
        
        That's not correct. It is mandatory that all Blu-ray players support the lossy audio formats (DTS 5.1 and Dolby Digital 5.1) for DVD and Blu-ray. The Panasonic BDP-35, while only 2-channel via analog, will decode the advanced audio codecs (DTS-HD MA and Dolby TrueHD) to output as multi-channel PCM or even bitstream them to a capable surround receiver via HDMI.
        
        Dolby Digital Plus is a dead format. It died with HD DVD, the format it was pretty much intended for since HD DVD had limitations on bandwidth/transfer rates.
        
        The oppo is the player to get if you have a large collection of DVDs and want the best player-based deinterlacing of those discs. If you can get it, why compromise?
        
        Anyone know of a retailer for the Oppo that offers financing? - wheezer 09:39:04 11/22/09 (2)
        
        In Reply to: RE: support posted by Joe Murphy Jr on November 22, 2009 at 07:29:13
        
        The oppo is the player to get if you have a large collection of DVDs and want the best player-based deinterlacing of those discs. If you can get it, why compromise?
        Well that solves that.
        Thanks, this was the quickest research/decision due to the help of you guys.
        Thanks again.
        Mitch
        
        Consider the Pioneer BDP-320 - pbarach 09:48:37 11/22/09 (1)
        
        In Reply to: RE: Anyone know of a retailer for the Oppo that offers financing? posted by wheezer on November 22, 2009 at 09:39:04
        
        Has very nice upconverting of DVD's, beautiful Blu-Ray pic (but it's slow to load). And it has 7.1 analog outs with adustable crossover for bass management, delay and level settings for each speaker. The analog sound quality is excellent. This machine is now selling for just over $200.
        
        RE: Consider the Pioneer BDP-320 - wheezer 10:51:11 11/22/09 (0)
        
        In Reply to: RE: Consider the Pioneer BDP-320 posted by pbarach on November 22, 2009 at 09:48:37
        
        Is it new? No review on cnet.
      - RE: Sorry for the confusion... I won't be using DVD-A or SACD... - Ben Van Dyk 10:30:20 11/21/09 (0)
        
        In Reply to: RE: Sorry for the confusion... I won't be using DVD-A or SACD... posted by wheezer on November 21, 2009 at 09:10:08
        
        hi mitch I went to my home page typed blu ray upscaling dvd bluray player & found bluray,com.not sure if they were all upscaling the dvds but all the brandnames are there.some did say upscaling dvd.
        dvd audio & multichannel sacds rule
this may help - Joe Murphy Jr 17:02:40 11/19/09 (3)
There are players which can alter the level of their analog outputs. These players change that level in the digital domain.

For DSP work, changes are done in the digital domain. The analog input would be converted to digital and then the processing would take place. This new signal should then be converted to analog for volume adjustment, but there may be processors out there which adjust the volume in the digital domain.

For an AVR, the better ones will be analog from the input to the output and will only convert to digital if you require processing of the signal (bass management, delay, etc). The lesser ones will convert all analog inputs to digital -- regardless of whether you want to do processing or not.
- A little? - wheezer 17:22:57 11/19/09 (2)
  Great explanation.
  In audio, the last place one would want to alter volume is the digital domain.
  Is it worth doing analog out if it's up/down converted?
  - no conversion via analog - Joe Murphy Jr 20:19:02 11/20/09 (1)
    If you use a player's analog outputs, there is no up or downconversion of the digital signal.* However, adjusting the volume via the player (since this is done in the digital domain) will degrade the audio. By how much? That's for the user to decide.
    
    * Some Panasonics offer a resampling mode that will do this, but the change in the sound -- good or bad -- means you have changed what the original content was intended to sound like. Furthermore, the use of this feature is willingly made by the user (ie, it's not being forced by the manufacturer/author).
    - RE: no conversion via analog - wheezer 20:35:52 11/20/09 (0)
      I'm familiar with that process as I have a mac mini for headless audio playback. Adjusting the volume in itunes is a no-no.
      Thank you.

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