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I'm interested in buying a used plasma tv to replace my 1st gen Sony Hi Def.
I think that a good brand name is important, (any suggestions?) and the latest year that is affordable is a great idea.
Since I have some vintage equipment, S-video and possible composite would be good. I'm assuming that all Plasma TV's have HDMI connectors.
Other than that, I am open to suggestions on what to look for,as well as what to avoid.
I am not open to LCD or DLP.
Proudly serving content-free posts since 1984.
If I was in the market I would jump all over it.
Meat; It's the right thing to do. Romans 14:2
I have three Panasonic Viera plasma sets (42, 50 and 65). They've all operated flawlessly and are still going strong. Hope they last until OLED is more affordable.
as Led is the logical progression of the incandescent bulb.
The Mind has No Firewall~ U.S. Army War College.
Seek out a Pioneer Elite- the best Plasma, ever produced.
By what many of the review sites I frequent said, the last couple generations of Panasonics equaled or even surpassed the Pioneer sets. Panasonic did buy the rights to Pioneers technology when Pioneer quit the plasma business (Pioneer was using Panasonic panels for their Kuros, anyway).
You should know that Panasonic NEVER used the plasma technology that made Kuros unique. It was deemed too expensive [note Pio's success in the plasma biz... :)].
It was chemistry, not electronics, probably physics too, but mostly chemistry. We don't even know if Panasonic got the patent rights to use it, since it was never specifically stated AFAIK, no real point in acquiring something you won't use, but who knows how they think.
IIRC there were only 3 companies that ever made panels. Pioneer was an extremely small company in the display biz. Far far smaller than their reputation might make you think. No way they could afford their own panel factory. Just like 99% of American electronics "manufacturers"/brands can't afford their own factory. Doesn't mean much, you farm out work to people who can do it.
Edit: doh!, forgot my main point. What all us plasma lovers were looking forward to was Panasonic using this Pioneer chemistry in their subsequent models, and moving it far forward. But the writing was on the wall, LCD was cheaper, was well-marketed due to its greater affordability, and did have some "green" and size (thickness) advantages that were also promoted. Quality has never been a mass-market selling point, product looks will trump it there every time.
All true points. For me it wasn't LCD that dealt the final death blow to plasma (although LCD would've killed it eventually), it was 4k. Who in the hell wants a 600 pound plasma screen?!? Assuming the cells in the plasma glass were about as small as they could make them, the only other way to do 4k plasma was to make the screen 4 times a large ... and can you imagine the power consumption and heat?
We don't want to start that argument over again, but the reviewer that said that was comparing a four year old Kuro that had seen daily use against a brand spanking new last gen Panny. So maybe we should just agree to disagree.
I guess I'll be another one to agree to disagree. What Hornlover said above was not determined by just one review or reviewer but several and the reviewer that you are referring to calibrated both sets, the Pioneer measured virtually the same as it did 4 years prior (Minolta LS-100 light meter used in 2009, a greater precision Klein K-10 used in 2013). You are also ignoring that the Pioneer Elite Kuro cost $7,000 and the Panasonic Viera TC-P65ZT60 cost $3,800 and when you factor in that the Kuro is 60" and the Viera 65", the panasonic is less than half the cost of the Kuro.
2009 Kuro Measurements
2013 Kuro Measurements
black level 0.0015 ft-L (Klien meter measures 4 places)
white 33.6 ft-L
"But at these high measured contrast ratios, it's unlikely that there will be much of a visible difference, if any, between the two readings." Thomas J. Norton on October 15, 2013
Okay, here we go again. The claim is absurd on its face. Had Pioneer stayed in the plasma business for four more years and advanced their technology, how much better would they have been than Panny?!? The ONLY thing you can claim is that the final versions of the Panny were only as good as a four year old Pioneer! That is not something I'd be crowing about.
"The ONLY thing you can claim is that the final versions of the Panny were only as good as a four year old Pioneer!"
LOL, that IS the ONLY claim made by all those reviewers - that Panasonic had equalled in a couple of areas and SURPASSED in several the Pioneer Kuros. What is absurd is that you are now trying to change that fact with a "what if" question that is pointless. If Pioneer had stayed in the business and had made a better plasma than Panasonics Viera then no one would have made the claim. LOL
You were proven wrong in the 2014 post and you are still wrong. No matter how you spin it, "it was a 4 year old TV or what if Pioneer had stayed in the business", the conclusion remains the same - Panasonic Vieras equalled or bettered Pioneer Kuros. Nothing to argue about, it has been proven both subjectively and objectively. It is what it is.
The good news is that there will be a replacement for our plasmas that already has better picture quality than a plasma and the [OLED] technology will continue to get even better and I'm crowing about that.
Okay, crowing and pointless arguments aside, which OLED's have you seen you really liked? I saw the early entrants from Sammy and was not impressed in a favorable way, but then the viewing environment was your typical Best Buy. That's been a couple of years ago now and I really haven't personally seen any others since. Surely there must have been refinements.
At CES 2016 LG's signature series (55"-77") looked stunning and also supports HDR. OLED panels have improved with brighter displays and a wider color gamut. They also figured out how to make all the subpixel diodes last the same amount of time as well as other technical improvements. Panasonic has OLED TVs for 2016 and Sony may follow as well, which will help to bring down the price and help with even more improvements.
"LG's OLED TVs deliver the best picture quality of any TV we've ever tested, and in 2016 the company is expanding the lineup even further." -CNET
"If there were any lingering doubts about OLED being the true successor to plasma, CES 2016 shattered them. Across the show floor, new OLED TV models from LG and Panasonic managed to outshine all the competition" -THE VERGE
I do not like LCD and would not choose one over OLED but I must admit some of the best using HDR, IPS, Quantum Dot and local dimming technologies were pretty impressive (for an LCD!). Panasonic, LG and Samsung models all looked great.
mrdavis, you're not such a bad guy after all! Thanks for catching me up on the current OLED offerings. My biggest objection to the early Sammys was that they made everything look like a cartoon. Incredibly artificial looking. I have a decided predilection toward the film-look and not the video-look, and those early Sammys were just, well, awful looking to me - the video-look on steroids. However, I saw it at BB and they are certainly not known for presenting their products in a flattering manner. The sales guy that schmoozed me while I was looking was their senior TV department guy and he seemed really proud of it and told me that he'd personally overseen the tweaking of the picture. I uncharacteristically bit my tongue, thanked him for his time and left the store. I am encouraged that OLED is making progress toward being a worthy replacement for our beloved plasma screens.
Hey I really am a nice guy just ask my friends, I have all the friends money can buy!!!
Sounds like the salesman got carried away with his color and motion adjustments. You can always set the motion adjustments (blur and judder) to your taste or completely turn them off so it should not be a problem. I think OLEDs will be an excellent replacement for plasma, the picture quality looks fantastic.
Well, its not like they were able to compare it against a new Pioneer, since they were discontinued some years ago.
Pioneer Elite Signature series are the best of the best, but to your point you won't go wrong with either a Pio Elite or one of the later gen Panny's.
last of the '60 series' Panasonic Plasma sets were probably the best Plasma sets ever produced. I wish I could have made the swap from my 50" / 30 series.
Now? Waiting game for OLED, as I've seen already in this thread.
Because of OLED coming on now, I'm not TOO worried that Plasma apparently can't be made economically as a 4k panel.
No led/lcd for me, or rear projection, for that matter. In the 'Cost-No-Object' arena, maybe a Sony SXRD projector? IF they can convince me they NO LONGER use Plastic Filters which change for the WORSE with age / light exposure.
Too much is never enough
Probably more Panasonics out there than any other, and they are great. My 50" Panasonic plasma has been going since 2007, and still looks wonderful, and it gets a lot of use. I still find the color and saturation so pleasing, even after 9 years of use. I'm sure it will die some day, and I'm not looking forward to that. By then, hopefully OLED will be cheap and all the kinks worked out. Until then....
Can't go wrong with a gently used Panasonic Viera.
I've had mine for 6 years and counting.
Meat; It's the right thing to do. Romans 14:2
Panasonic Veira, killer TV. Love mine.
Gee Geeze...I would have thought you considerably more advanced in years.
You can often check the power-on hours via network or some other means, might be worthwhile to do that. At least other used plasma buyers recommend it, I'm not so sure it matters since they usually have a 40k hour minimum lifetime, and many are rated for a 100k hour useable lifetime...maybe more important if you think the panel was a demo or used commercially, or possibly for really extended gaming.
Also related to that, watch the screen when you first turn the plasma on, not immediately but after it "stabilizes" for 10s or so. See if you see any burn-in. Also play some 4:3 material in 4:3 format and look to the sides to see if you notice any deterioration. Simple to do, it really will show a lot very quickly and won't "give away" that you're clued in.
Take a gander at the screen coatings using a flashlight, the better ones have coating of at least some type. You'll notice any glass hairline cracks at the same time, and if the coatings were scratched or improperly cleaned.
Bring a disc or memory stick (if it has USB, most do) with basic full-screen one-color test patterns. All white is good, you'll notice any stuck/dead pixels immediately, but also all-R/G/B too.
If the used name-brand good-model plasma is even remotely close to a good deal, you won't have a lot of time if the plasma is generally advertised and not from an acquaintance, high demand still. But try to find out about parts availability, especially power supplies.
Just because a plasma has a stuck pixel or shows evidence of too much sustained/unvaried 4:3 viewing etc. doesn't mean it won't still be pretty good. I'm just really picky, and bought in the days when *zero* stuck/dead pixels was the maximum acceptable number for a quality model...that quickly changed when they started manufacturing panels "elsewhere" for certain brands... [A few stuck/dead pixels, or even one :), in the middle of the screen is incredibly annoying to me, I can't NOT see them.]
Some good advice, thank you.
I thought pixel problems were only with LCD screens, not plasma.
I have no idea how to check maximum hours, could you explain further?
Proudly serving content-free posts since 1984.
Sorry, I can't explain, there are so many different ways it's done, but be assured the "hour meter" is in there somehow, possibly easily accessed using a simple app over your network. e.g. my Pio requires an RS-232 interface to access or a "service remote". Newer plasmas use the net but usually it's a 3rd party app that may not be free, though usually you can find a free one for a specific model. I have to say that any semi-serious plasma owner *who looks after their display* is certain to have the app and hour-meter access...maybe a clue there as to how the plasma may have been treated.
I wouldn't put huge stock in the number of hours unless you think it's possibly really high, like on full-time for several years. e.g. We used to install plasmas at work because it was the only display tech we could install where the "public" couldn't physically get at the displays, yet they could also be read from the large viewing angles involved (very limited viewing angles, still, with LCD).
There's also usually a power cycle counter, various internal fault counters, etc., all worth checking for the terminally anal (though the unscrupulous can and do reset them). Plasmas are incredibly complex, and they have an internal aging algorithm/mechanism since the different colored phosphors "age" at different rates and they try to compensate for that electronically. They usually do it poorly, the manufacturers were way too pessimistic and they prematurely "age" the phosphors. So don't be totally turned off if things look a bit off, usually it's too red, they really do tend to age the red phosphors way too fast, and it can affect the perceived black levels (e.g. Pio and Panny). You can turn the aging back with a bit of effort (Pio), not sure about all Panasonics or the others. Every model is different, never mind every brand.
I'm making it sound way too complex, sorry. Probably best to buy used from somebody who's an HT or A/V nut, who simply "upgraded"/updated to something 4K and larger etc. That way you'll know the plasma was probably well cared for, and it was simply replaced rather than went bad. They'll also likely ask more...
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