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What are your votes for most overrated and most underrated movies of all time? Here are mine:Overrated: Citizen Kane, Titanic
Underrated: Loch Ness
Follow Ups:
I'm sorry. I've seen Citizen Kane and consider it to be the finest film I have ever seen - bar none.Most overrated - Moulin Rouge (it made so many best 10 lists! Did they see the same film I saw?)
Almost as bad - Unbreakable (Loved the Sixth Sense. This film was like a bad comic book in slow motion.)
Most underrated - Juliet of the Spirits. (a small gem of a movie.)
Overrated: Nosferatu
Underrated: Hard Times
he's a great director (technical aspect), but he doesn't have a head (scrip). I'm pretty sure he's blond, that why he's wearing a cap all the time.
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not underrated, but what a poor distribution. Btw, it is one of the best movie that year.
No opinion on the overrated category.On the underrated category, I have two:
1. Usual Suspects,
2. Zero effect
Zero Effect is indeed a superb, unknown film!
What a lousy one=trick ponyu, with some light lesbian erotica and misogynistic shock effect scenes. The Malkovich gimmick wore out pretty quickly.Although, there was an excellent movie within it waiting to made - just focusing on an extrememly tallented and tortured marionette artist. The street scene performance was rivoting.
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Probably all of the Star Wars movies are overrated (I am not sure on The Phantom Menace, though--haven't seen it), but I don't think they are terrible films, either. The amount of hype, hoopla, and marketing that goes along with them is the most annoying thing to me, however, so I may be downgrading the content unfairly.I had selected Rollerball as being underrated in another post but may have opted for Logan's Run if I had thought of it at the time. I realize a lot of people have problems with Logan's Run, however. It was a very ambitious sci-fi effort for its time and did not fall flat on its face IMO, even though a lot of people seem to think so.
Todd
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I'm amazed at how many people think Silence of the Lambs is a good film when I had so much trouble just trying to pay attention. I guess I've just seen too many shocking, low-budget gorefests for me to take an overdone major studio release seriously.Underrated: Rollerball
Special Mention: Wild, Wild West--I guess I just didn't take the original show seriously enough to be annoyed by this admittedly not so great, but not (IMHO) horrible film either. I did find it entertaining when just considered as an entity unto itself. I know I'm in a 1% minority on this film, however.
Todd
"West" was a fun romp, nice fodder after hard day 's work. Not embarassingly overripe. The violence against empowered wheelchair bound (not handicapped was surprisingly risky bordering on bad taste but refreshingly NOT POLcorrect.
Now "Way of the Gun" was unhyped and forgotton most modern "western"
My pick for 1 of 5 best of 2000. - K. AAron CNAOPOBNy
...pretentious and silly peace of ... fill the blank. I had to make three or four attempts to even cover about 80% of it.
If you didn't like this you must be nuts!
I liked Silence of the Lambs, but found it a little unsettling that they gave it the Oscar for Best Picture.That's a reflection of our society. Do we really want to be giving an Oscar to a film that depicts such subject manner?
Sign of the Times. Perhaps in the 50's the movie would have never been made or been banned. Societal evolution or deterioration?
... "Silence of the Lambs" was intense, suspensful and brilliantly filmed, IMHO. For the record, I don't believe in banning movies or books for controversial content; films have ratings to inform the public about the appropriateness of subject matter and a policy enforcing age restrictions.As for the Academy, members only rarely deign to give controversial topics the level of attention deserved (i.e., in the major categories the coveted Oscar usually goes to the most mainstream material), so I don't believe that the film industry can be seriously viewed as an accurate barometer of social decline. To the contrary, entertainment is often the scape goat for other failings (i.e., social, parental, political, economic, etc.) endemic in an overpopulated contemporary society; films are a reflection of the marketplace, not the other way around.
AuPh
which had plentiful T&A with beautiful women, was mostly non-violent and had a story. Unfortunately the story was buried in ham-handed writing, but with 'darkstar approved' editing could have made it to the Academy Awards.For overrated I'd second 'Citizen Kane' which when I saw it first umpteen years ago was GREAT. I played it for the kids a couple weeks ago and was amazed at how unimpressive it was.
r
but it was not a classic film, either. Still, as I watched it (at home on LD), I had a hard time understanding why it had been so badly trashed. As you indicate, it probably could have been a lot better, so perhaps this film is more of an underachiever than an outright horrible movie (well, IMO anyway).Todd
But, then again, almost everything is.
bad casting
bad acting
horrible script
incomprehensible soundtrack
wretched post production
looks like it was lit in a cave with kerosene lanterns...
even the costumes lack imagination
who approved this crap?
there's not even a hint of a plot
no sex
no violence
not even a chase scene
does Rumsfeld have a clue?
even i could fake a video better than that...totaly unbelievable
hasn't anyone sent him a copy of "M" ?
or "Wag the Dog" ????
is this the best the CIA is capable of ???
our tax dollars at work????
what we need is a Democratic administration with some imagination and Hollywood connections....
the horror...
at least Hitler dressed his henchmen wellOsama, call my agent.
Not ready to laugh at this type of stuff yet.
A U.S. Production, executive producer, George Bush, directed by
Tommy Franks, starring Geraldo Riveria as a mild-mannered reporter who
tracks down the stealthy villain, Osama Bin Satan. Filmed on
location in Tora Bora, Afghanistan.
I won´t give away plot details, but will hint Geraldo does make a
quick clothing change in Dr. Who´s telephone booth in Osama´s main
cavepad. Then all hell breaks loose as SuperGerry kicks some
Osamic butt! - AH
That showed even 20 odd years ago that all is not as black and white-or colour as shown to the people--Hmmmm?Pondering,
Des
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..."The Shawshank Redemption" is the most overrated film. I also thought "Tootsie" was an overrated, one-joke comedy.Underrated? Hmmm, maybe "Behind The Green Door"?:-0
nt
I go along with Tootsie -- too long too. Shawshank is one of my favorites though.Another Overrated pick (this will be total heresy to many):
Rain Man ugh! Speaking of one note,how about Hoffman's performance?also WAY overrated: Scent of a Woman, and especially Pacino's performance. Hooowah!
nt
*
Seriously, looking at them objectively, I don't see how you could describe the Jurassic Park series as overrated. Overhyped (i.e., as in advertised out the wazoo) maybe, but as big budget action/thrillers go the JP series delivers as promised. So, describing them as overrated is a bit disingenuous, don't you think? Perhaps dinos just aren't your cup-o-tea.I've never even heard of "The Yards" so it's definitely not overhyped, but I have no idea how it rates either. At any rate (grin), I'll check this film out when the opportunity arises.
Cheers,
AuPh
I guess I'm not a great Dinasaur/Speilberg fan, you're right!
I don't know if 'The Yards' is really the most underrated film, probably not, but I enjoyed it's sombre, almost slow, moody feel.
Here's a link : http://www.theyardsmovie.com/
All the best, Jeff
Just teasin'! ;^)Seriously, in my informed opinion Citizen Kane isn't overrated at all! At the time of it's release Kane was major step forward for sound motion pictures, from it's visually stunning cinematography (i.e., Welle's had obviously been influenced by all-but-forgotten Expressionist styles which had been explored by silent era filmmakers at Germany's UFA studios) to it's inspired pseudo-documentary storytelling technique complete with fake newsreel footage, all of which culminates in the brilliant allegorical conclusion to which the audience is sole voyeur.
No, Citizen Kane has had an undeniable impact on filmmaking as an art form even though it was unappreciated by much of the viewing public at the time of it's release. Most film aficionados now acknowledge it's greatness and even those who don't like the movie because of it's subject matter, or whatever, usually respect it's genius. So, I guess one could say that Citizen Kane WAS one of the most underrated films, but for those with a discriminating palate it has aged quite well.
As for the other two films you mentioned: Even though I like Titanic, I'm forced to agree with you that it probably is a bit overrated (i.e., in this case by the viewing public more than the critics), but aside from that I still admire its period grandeur and epic quality; all in all, a very moving film.
BTW, I don't recall having seen Loch Ness, but I'll make a point of checking it out!
Cheers,
AuPh
I don't know how you could possibly call Citizen Kane UNDERRATED when many critics hail it as the greatest movie of all time. The greatest movie of all time and an utter bore to the population at large (rightly or wrongly)I appreciate you expressing well informed points, however. Perhaps I'll give it another watch. I haven't seen it in many years.
Another UNDERRATED pick: Groundhog Day. wonderful story. doesn't go over on the under 30 crowd.
Loch Ness is dismissed by many because it has Ted Danson in it. He does an excellent job as does the rest of the cast, especially Ian Holm. People also dismiss it entirely due to the subject matter. If you don't have a problem with the subject matter, Loch Ness is a magnificent film with absolutely beautiful cinematography.
> > > .......The greatest movie of all time and an utter bore to the population at large ......you got that one right. Kane is the greatest only for its originality. To say its the best among modern time's greatests is a bit farfetched. These days, watching it with pleasures is like listening to a piece of music strictly for the pin-point imaging. A great film must be judged on several fronts: originality, photographic quality, acting skills and the chemistry among the actors, story and the manner in which it is told, and musics, among others.
If youre falling asleep, it can't be the greatest.
> > > "Kane is greatest only for its originality." < < <If that were ALL, it would still be AMONG the greatest.
> > > "To say its the best among modern time's greatests is a bit far fetched." < < <
As I recall this thread wasn't limited to modern films, dependent upon one's opinion of what's modern. Nevertheless, Kane IS among the greatest of all time even though some may consider it lower on the list. BTW, assessing it as number one isn't far fetched at all, IMHO.
> > > "A great film must be judged on several fronts: originality, photographic quality, acting skills and the chemistry among the actors, story and the manner in which it is told, and musics, among others." < < <
Okay, limiting the assessment to just those barest parameters, let's see how well Kane has aged:
Originality - I believe we've covered that; Citizen Kane was certainly an original concept in both theme and style, and quite daring for it's day. By just about any standards it was and IS high art, influenced by but not imitating German expressionist films of the silent era by Lang, Murnau, Pabst, et al.
Photographic quality - Citizen Kane's cinematography is exquisite, from it's scene transitions to the incredible angles, close-ups, and distance shots chosen to provide a symbolic context to the lives of the characters. In capturing Welle's vision on film Greg Toland seems to have accomplished the impossible.
Acting skills - Just about every actor in Citizen Kane received a career boost from the film. The performances were so good that even those actors who had only appeared on radio and/or stage in Welle's Mercury Theater productions became stars virtually overnight.
Chemistry among the actors - Where is the chemistry lacking? Isn't Joseph Cotton believeable as Kane's collegue and as a former friend? How about the women in Kane's life who grow distant from him with the passing years? Even the secondary actors put in first rate performances which are quite memorable.
Story and the manner in which it's told - The screenplay won an Academy Award, split between Orson Welles and Herman Mankiewicz, in spite of the fact that the William Randolph Hearst tried to have the film destroyed. This was a major accomplishment and an indication of just how much more praise and success this film would've probably received had the story been less controversial and it's brilliantly scribed ironies watered down for public consumption.
and musics - What? You don't care for Bernard Herrmann's ominously brooding score? Shame on you!
> > > "If you're falling asleep, it can't be the greatest." < < <
That's just silly. Children often whine and fall asleep in movies targeted to an adult audience; why should Citizen Kane be downgraded because there might be someone suffering from somnambulism in the audience?
AuPh
> > > "I don't know how you could possibly call Citizen Kane UNDERRATED when many critics hail it as the greatest movie of all time." < < <Well, it isn't underrated now, but during it's first run it couldn't find an audience in spite of much critical praise for it's cinematography. Of course that praise wasn't from critics working for Hearst papers, since his papers refused to run ads for the film. BTW, I don't actually believe Kane has ever been overrated.
> > > "The greatest movie of all time and an utter bore to the population at large (rightly or wrongly)." < < <
When I first saw Kane back in my college days as part of a film studies program I was far from bored; I was mesmerized! Of course audiences today are far less accepting of B&W films and the stagier dramatic styles prevalent in earlier eras. That doesn't mean that I'm taking a slap at the stark realism of today's cinema, but as a society I think that we'll have lost a great deal if we ever reach a point where we can't view classic films in the context of when they were made without classifying them as quaint novelties.
> > > "Perhaps I'll give it another watch. I haven't seen it in many years." < < <
The best way to watch Citizen Kane is to try clearing your mind of the Rosebud "McGuffin" the reporter is chasing. Focus instead on the story as a tragic tale of a life wasted in poverty, not poverty in respect to the wealth Kane never had to seriously concern himself with, but rather poverty in regards to having his humanity stripped from him as a child and growing to adulthood without ever again experiencing parental love and compassion. On this level the film becomes more of a human allegory with contemporary applications rather than a thinly veiled semi-biographical one about Hearst.
> > > "Another UNDERRATED pick: Groundhog Day. wonderful story." < < <
Hey, if you can watch Groundhog Day over and over again, you should be able to resurrect a little Kane too! ;^)
FTR, I will definitely be checking out Loch Ness. And thanks, highendman, for sharing your thoughts!
Cheers,
AuPh
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the English patient maybe but not out of...
It's hard to choose.
Overrated - E.T.
Underrated - Shadow of the Vampire
I just saw this last week and was extremely disappointed. Here we have a handful of fantastic actors, excellent makeup, a great premise . . . and somehow they managed to botch it. Truly horrible editing. Uninspired acting. The directing was boring. You get the feeling that they left all the good parts on the cutting room floor.I'd say that the one single scene that was worth anything was when Max Schreck was explaining how Bram Stoker's Dracula was such a sad story because Dracula had no servants.
I will say that Willem Dafoe did a decent job of acting creepy . . and it was fun to see Eddie Izzard in a halfway decent role . . but overall it was not much of a film.
I saw this last week when I rented the DVD and I found it dull and humorless with generally uninspired acting. A real disappointment given some of the buzz which preceeded it. Am I the only person getting tired of John Malkovic? He seems to be the same character in every film I see him in...joe
between "over-hyped" and "over-rated". I, too was a little dissapointed in that the film didn't live up to my expectations, but I felt it was better than what most people thought, therefore "underrated."
Over rated: Gladiator
Under rated: Being There
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