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The dialog on most movies is not distinct, volume must be turned very high to get clarity, and have even had to use an equalizer to boost mids and highs to get clarity. My speakers and electronics are very good and sound great with music. Sound sources are cable with digital box and DVD using its stereo outputs.Will a new processor help? My present Rotel 930-AX has only available the Dolby Pro Logic mode and only older movies sound good such as the ones done in DLP or even Super Stereo. Will a new processor with Dolby Digital or Prologic II give me better dialog clarity and not require an equalizer to boost mids and highs? Will digital processing really improve dialog clarity?
Follow Ups:
You guys are missing the point of my question.Please understand I have excellent speakers, all matched. Also have excellent amplifiers, all matched.
I am using a Rotel processor (old ) that provides Dolby Pro Logic (analog only) extraction to L&C&R plus two surround speakers. All works fine in older movies encoded with DLP.
My problem is most acute with new movies encoded in DD, DTS or DLP II.
Will the dialog lack of clarity go away if I decode these newer movies with a newer processor that uses digital inputs to decode DD, DTS or DLP II?
I don't want to spend the money for a new processor unless I will get dialog that is more clear than what I am getting from my older analog set up.
Thanks for your help.
Your problem is likely to be the extraction of the Center information from a pro-logic decoder..... you are taking the stereo output from your DVD player and having your receiver decode it as pro-logic, right????can't see how this would be good!
There is no discrete channel information, only synthesized.
Now, what DD/DTS decoder to get. My older Sony 444ES gave good discreet channel separation but the center channel had similar issues as you are describing (even though it was properly decoding the discrete chennels), i just switched over to a Denon 3805 receiver and the center info (as well as all other channels) is much better.... voices come through very well.
Sam
This problem has been documented by several HomeTheater magazines and forums. The common complaint is that center channel information isn't as loud or as clear as one would expect with a discrete digital format. The only cure is to raise the center channel level a few dBs to bring it to a level that is comfortable for the user.Since you do not have a new surround receiver/processor, you are not decoding these new formats (Dolby Digital, DTS) in their native state. That said, are you using a DVD player that can decode Dolby Digital and DTS and output the down-converted 2-channel information on the analog stereo outputs or are you just listening to the 2-channel Dolby Surround track on the DVD? I have found that players doing the decoding and down-converting internally for 2-channel analog output are, at best, sub-optimal. That shouldn't be the case, but experience has proven otherwise.
By the way, no movies are Dolby Pro-Logic II encoded on DVD, but they can be Dolby Surround encoded.
If you don't want to spend big bucks, I would suggest the new Yamaha HTR-5760 receiver. You can get them for <$400 on the net (I saw a few units on ebay recently -- brand new, from online vendors -- with Buy It Now prices of $339 + shipping). Talk about inexpensive! If you'd like to use outboard amps and just let the receiver do the decoding of the DTS and Dolby Digital soundtracks on the DVD, this model also has 7.1 preamp outputs.
Here's a link to the HTR-5760. I would suggest that you do not go below this model (above is fine) for consideration:
Your response is succinct and hits my concerns with accuaracy. I have been too much a dedicated analog guy over the years and only in the last year have realized just how far behind the curve I am.So, my plan is to get an Outlaw 950. I am not a fan of receivers, although I guess they have improved in the last few years. I am willing to spend a few bucks to get movie sound satisfaction and assume the Outlaw 950 might be a step up from a receiver.
My next concern is whether to get the Outlaw or go to a Rotel 1068. The Rotel costs almost double the Outlaw 950 and the nearest dealer is 90 miles away. Is the Rotel worth the extra cost and inconvenience? CD playback sound is not a great concern. So many choices, so little time. . . .
Thanks again for your help.
Dick
You can find some reviews of each processor on the web. If you definitely need a processor, you might want to take a look at the new Sherwood Newcastle processor (P-965). It goes for about the same price as the Rotel and there are comparisons available at AVS Forum. I believe there is a dedicated thread comparing these two processors.I am not familiar with any of them (Outlaw, Rotel, Sherwood), as far actual listening goes, so sound-wise it's your decision. Here's a link to the Amps, Receivers and Processors part of AVS forum. You may have to use the Search function to get to the comparison threads:
Actually I have already read about all the reviews of all the products you mentioned, plus a lot of very favorable comments about the Outlaw 950.My main concern was dialog clarity and would it improve if the movie were decoded with DD or DTS instead of with my old DPL. You and others have convinced that digital is the way to go.
So, the Outlaw is convenient (on-line ordering) and it has a 30 day no questions asked return policy. Why not give it a try?
Dick
First, you need a quality center channel speaker, ideally one from the same manufacturer as the right and left fronts and voiced the same or very similarly.Pro Logic matrixes 4.1 sound out of stereo (the ".1" is a sub output). Pro Logic II matrixes 5.1 sound out of stereo (i.e., the rears are separate). Dolby Digital 5.1 (and DTS 5.1) are RECORDED in 5.1 and thus are discreet and do sound better (music, effects, and dialog). Newer processors also have:
Pro Logic IIx which matrixes 6.1 or 7.1 sound from stereo; DtS Neo 6
which does the same thing, only better (each of these has different codecs for music and for movies) and even newer circuits which matrix 6.1 out of 5.1 and also have discreet 7.1 capabilities.All speakers should be equi-distant for the sweet spot in an arc and all channels should be at the same level, ideally set with a sound level meter calibrated to 75db. There should be no need (or rare need) to boost the center channel.
Pro-Logic is a stereo soundtrack. Rear speakers are a mono channel matrixed into the stereo mix. There is no ".1" in a Pro-Logic soundtrack. In essence, Pro-Logic is "4.0"
Why did my old Pro Logic pre/pro have a sub woofer output?
nt
I also had a Pro-Logic receiver with a subwoofer output. Sub outputs were added to later model PL receivers for convenience as powered subs were becomeing more popular. But for all intent purposes, PL did not have a dedicated LFE channel.
You need a good center speaker, dont save on it, the most important speaker for AV...I connect both Cable TV and DVD to my Krell Showcase processor using digital coaxial, then let it convert to analog, do bass management and DPLII if the source is stereo, very clear dialog through my Proac CC2 center...
Antonio Melo Ribeiro
"Sound sources are cable with digital box and DVD using its stereo outputs."Others can confirm, but I suspect that your problem lies in the phrase "stereo outputs."
The clearest dialogue from a movie is from a dedicated CENTER channel speaker, with the movie's audio mode being surround sound.
When the dialogue gets routed into a stereo pattern, it has "to compete" with all the other sound on the soundtrack.
I have trouble with dialogue on many of my DVDs, because I view and listen to them through a stereo TV.
regards, townsend
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