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I am curious as to why people here are so emotionally invested in their favorite hi def format.
Who cares?
Not that I want these competing posts to stop - they are very entertaining. I'm just curious what the motivation is?
Hukk
Follow Ups:
Some here seem to have forgotten that. There is a reason audiophiles and videophiles want to learn about superior cables, recordings, components and yes...formats.
When you lead off with "who cares", you've just phoned it in.
-------------"I have found that if you love life, life will love you back." -Arthur Rubinstein (1887-1982)
I care because I happen to like being able to choose 1080p movies on physical media.
"Not that I want these competing posts to stop - they are very entertaining."
The appeal wears off after a week or two.
"I'm just curious what the motivation is?"
Seasonal depression?
...if you picked the "losing" format. I picked a side simply because of my belief one format has the higher potential for better picture/sound quality (and eventually features); though others disagree. Some of my HD investment will be "betamaxed" either way but there needs to be an end to this format war before wider adoption has a chance.
The brick and mortar stores don't want to maintain dual inventories so they will pressure the studios to pick sides. Others want all the studios to release on both formats and/or make cheap dual format players the final solution. And so it goes.
Stakes are pretty high. The outcome of the format war will drive the future of consumer HD video media for the next decade (or at least until the next generation super HD consumer format appears (e.g. 4k?)).
Hi,
Speaking of the B&M big box stores and CC in particular (I have to admit I haven't visited BB) I go strolling in a couple of weeks ago seeking a couple of SACDs. My new Oppo will play them and I was curious to see how they sounded. I couldn't find any and when I asked -- no kidding -- there was not even one person on their sales floor who even knew what SACD was. I started to explain it to one dufus but realized it was a waste of breath. Geez.
Blu-ray and HD DVD may end up going the same route, but who knows?
Cheers, Joe
PS One thing Beta v. VHS clearly showed us is that technical superiority will NOT convince the masses which to buy.
How long has Laserdisc held out as a niche format? There's considerable "value-added" for the AV enthusiast with a decent investment in HT. If nothing else, it'll tide me over until the next generation format shows up.
from when SACD and DVD-A were together in one forum a few years ago. There was just as much fighting, name-calling, misinformation and illogical deduction.
And once again, this format war is the fault of the content providers. They had the power to stop it then and they had the power to stop it this time.
and choose one format. They have not done so yet opting for competing formats. Toshiba and Sony could have agreed on a combined format as well saving the content providers from having to choose between formats.
The AVS forum's attempt to stop the bickering was to squelch any discussion of unsubstantiated rumors or stop obvious format war-related trolls. I'm not sure how successful it was but it seems a bit tame (dull) over there nowadays.
I can't see how you can separate the objectionable gloating from the facts about sales, etc.
The studios could have gotten together and agreed to not publish HD content on optical disc until the CE manufacturers agreed on one format.
And please, before anyone brings up anti-trust or other legal crap -- don't.
.
This used to be a forum where you could come, ask questions, and find helpful information on a variety of video topics.
But no longer. Fan boys have changed all that . . . it's all out war now, as they have unleashed their manure spreading machines.
About two weeks ago, I got tired of this and wrote a short post (see link below) directed at Ole. He responded rather defensively, like I was somehow impinging on his free speech. I was only stating a conclusion I had drawn from reading his posts. Apparently, others felt as I did (e.g., 4seasons: "A handful of people have essentially hijacked the forum, and I think it's time to look elsewhere for useful content."), but Ole feels compelled to soldier on.
I didn't respond to Ole at that time. I would like to point out that we can all use "google" and search down blu-ray as well as HD DVD statistics. Your posts are one-dimensional and repetitive, and therefore are serving no useful purpose. Sure, you can hijack the forum for your own purposes. Just like Kekl did to DVD-A. But you won't garner any respect from others. All you have to do is be more even-handed. This isn't the "blu-ray forum," or the "HD DVD forum," and it surely isn't the "hi-def video forum."
To Jazz Inmate, who's at a different spot, I appreciate your emphasis on the greater capacity of blu-ray, and the implications for both video and audio. We all know that, ad nauseum ad infinitum. The discussion of hi-def formats should be multifaceted, and not focus on just one issue. You've made your point . . . how about moving on?
I regularly enjoy reading posts of many others, including but not restricted to Jack, Joe Murphy Jr., Racerguy, Duilawyer, Audiophilander, Oscar, David Aiken, to name a few. In the past, I asked a question about viewing distance for hi-def video in trying to determine optimum plasma screen size, and got several helpful replies, and Jack provided me a link (I've bookmarked it; thanks again) to a graph.
If this weren't an online forum, but rather a meeting on a local level, several members would be asked to leave. I'm not asking anybody to leave . . . it ain't my forum, but a little courtesy would facilitate more productive discussion.
I am getting rather tired of silly jokes with no information, when I post a link with new sales numbers.
Yes, people can google, but few post links here.
I post Blu ray links, other can post HD DVD links.
I have made my views very clear, so the many readers of this forum can make their own judgement about the links I show.
They do not need additional comments from Jack and others.
You are basicly trying to limit information and free speech.
I would not like to to live in your local society.
But I will defend your right to post here. You might extend me the same courtesy.
You're upset that people are complaining about your posts. I think there is a valid reason why so many are unhappy with the content, and are venting their frustrations on you. The frustrations have little to do with the fact that you are a blatant Blu-ray Cheerleader. If you were an HD DVD Cheerleader, the reaction would be identical.
> > Yes, people can google, but few post links here. < <
It seems to me that most people come here to share their personal experiences, their likes and dislikes, and read the experiences and opinions of others. Outside of the lengthy flame-wars, those are the posts and discussions which seem to be most popular. Experiences and opinions don't need links to sales figures or articles about which technology is "winning."
The problem is, posting personal experiences is not what you're doing. Not even a little bit. You are posting propaganda. Your posts are a relentless stream of sales figures, press releases, slanted articles, and dubious op-eds. That is pretty much all you post. The information you are duplicating and reposting here is easily available to anyone with a web browser, should they care enough to find it. By constantly posting this stuff here, you are just acting as a mouthpiece for the Blu-ray propaganda machine.
You can say all you want, "Don't read my posts" but since the forum is literally over-run with your propaganda posts, it becomes hard to ignore, and people start complaining, stop reading, and target you for their frustrations. ZS KEKL did in the Hi-rez forum what you are doing now in this forum and he nearly ruined it, to the point that he was given his own forum to play in, where no one goes anymore. This could happen here if you keep doing what you're doing.
Again, it has nothing to do with Blu-ray - it has everything to do with you. If an HD DVD fanboy did what you are doing, I am quite sure the reaction to him would be identical.
> > You are basicly trying to limit information and free speech. But I will defend your right to post here. < <
No, he is not trying to limit free speech. He is trying to explain to you that he feels your exercise of your posting privilege (yes, privilege - this is a private forum, not a public soapbox) is excessive. You are simply spamming the forum with propaganda, not engaging in discussion.
> > I would not like to to live in your local society. < <
You talk about extending courtesy, but this is clearly an insult. Insults are discourteous. If you want to engage in insults, go right ahead, but please don't try to feign courtesy while you're doing it.
Ole, we don't need propaganda. Not from Blu-ray fanboys, not from HD DVD fanboys. There are plenty of places on the web where anyone can get as propagandized as they want. This is not that place.
to take the last matter first
Townsend wrote:
“If this weren't an online forum, but rather a meeting on a local level, several members would be asked to leave. I'm not asking anybody to leave”
I then write, “I would not like to to live in your local society”
If that is an insult, it cannot be directed towards Townsend, because his is not asking anybody to leave. It must be directed aginst those people, who would ask other people to leave a meeting due to a remark.
I am expressing, that I prefer to live in a freedom of speech society, with a high ceiling limit on remarks.
And I refer to Voltaire, who said "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it." That is truly a high ceiling for remarks and became the foundation for the laws giving freedom of speech.
Courtesy is more than politeness, it also means “Consent or agreement in spite of fact”
See http://www.answers.com/topic/courtesy
It came from the many italian courts, where blod was spilled on the floors by swords, often due to mistaken insults and hot tempers.
So it became promoted as an ideal behavoir in middle age courts, that you would accept insulting remarks in spite of facts, simply to be courteous. (outside the court you could still draw the swords)
Lets move on
at least some of my posts are not propaganda, and some people here read them with pleasure.
My recent post on a swedish region free Blu Ray player is not easy to find by googling. So here I helped some readers.
I have the advantage of reading English, German, Danish, Swedish fluently, and what I remember of my Latin helps me with technical Italian and French. So I can find more interesting links than many can, and concentrate them here. They are clearly marked with my name, so you can avoid them.
I also add an European perspective to the debate.
If I have changed this forum, it is due to my many post drawing many comments.
And I do engage in some of the discusions, here you are simply wrong.
But that is my freedom too. You can do the same. The moderators own and control the AA, and they have set rules, which you can read.
The HD DVD fans here call themself neutral, and they accept any HD DVD post in good faith. But they attack any blu ray post, thereby showing their true colours.
I have writtten in AA for many years, because I like the way the moderators act here.
I am not asking you to stop. And I would like to see a HD forum.
Your arrogance knows no bounds.
to comunicate.
Your arrogance is beyond measure.
.
.
.
The capacity issue, I believe, is being outright ignored by otherwise intelligent people. I find this absolutely unfathomable, and that's why I hammer it so often. You say you get the message, but I remain skeptical.As you've noticed, I'm not averse to personal attacks, but I ONLY levy them when I'm attacked first. Denizens who call me a fanboy don't deserve to be treated with respect. A fanboy is someone who has an illogical fetish for something. My adoption of blu-ray was the result of research; logical reasons. And only two of my 17 components are Sonys, contrary to Auph's insinuation that all the gear on my shelves is from Sony.
As for hijacking the forum, I'll admit to having hurt the signal to noise ratio, but I've never, ever discouraged anyone from posting questions or answers.
-------------"I have found that if you love life, life will love you back." -Arthur Rubinstein (1887-1982)
"...a little courtesy would facilitate more productive discussion."
Well said.
Even I have to admit i have made a choice and try to 'convert' the ignorant masses. DVD is good, HD and Blu is bad.
I am a moron! (Actually I really also do not give a darn what other folks do)
HD is what you make of it.
It's all relative.
Capacity doesn't matter.
Oooooooommmmmmmmm.
Seriously, what other folks do impacts the availability of the titles you want to purchase. So to say you don't care what other folks do is tantamount to saying you don't care what's available.
-------------"I have found that if you love life, life will love you back." -Arthur Rubinstein (1887-1982)
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