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86.2.168.92
A reconstruction of the final days of Hitler.
A powerful piece of cinema that shows the deconstruction of people caught within a situation where they have very limited control, and no future.
The people portrayed are a mixture of the ordinary and the truly awful, yet even the awful are not cyphers, but fully fleshed characters - which makes their decisions and actions even more terrible.
My wife & I found this film very effecting. The portrayal of a civilisation on the brink of destruction opens some interesting thoughts about our own predicament - dancing on the edge of disaster.
Highly recommended.
Follow Ups:
a
Good actors good scipts...
Downfall was merde...Eurotrash a la Hollywood...Bad.
A film for tourists.
Michael Haneke has made several engrossing films, including "Cache."
I was really disenchanted! And Victor ( we share much liking and disliking in common ) very bad critic of " Cache "...
When it will be aired on German TV I will take a look at it, of course, You know I canīt find many films nowadays that I really like, Tonight just saw " Rebecca " for the x time and you know what, the actors of this quality are rare, as rare as good films, the only one you can get with a certain amount of class comes from countries of the so-called third world, and there I feel mostly not at home.
Cīest la vie, and I am getting old...
and somewhat cruel person. Now, still like the film /;-)> ?
Cache I liked quite a bit, as much for the acting talent well realized as for the story. I imagine Vic disliked it for philosophical/political reasons.
I disliked "Pianiste," too.
Get over the third-world bias and you'll be a happy man.
On the other hand, do you consider Hong Kong, Taiwan, Thailand, and Hungard "third world?"
She made two films with Hitch and it show nowhere. And the Master really did get into the psychology of his actors!
He use it.
But anyway she is no Wagner, is she not?
Just a small actress...
Yes, I do....
PS: With third world, I meant of course, different cultures!
Now let us talk about Palestinia, I am afraid you are too sensitive when talking about films and we could somehow agree..
Victor think the same BTW.
Do you mean we could, if we tried, find common ground about Palestine-Israel issues?
I have little doubt.
I only wish the best for the nation of Israel and therefore feel a terrible sense of frustration from what I see as a policy leading to the opposite.
Believe me, I am no supporter of violent Palestinian tactics.
Understanding anger and frustration doesn't mean acceptance or approval.
Speaking in very broad terms, in my personal experience I have gotten along much, much better with Israelis than Arabs. On a weekly basis, I had business with both peoples over a five-year period.
No I did not mean that and after rereading me no wonder. I wrote badly but that is not the first time.
"Understanding anger and frustration doesn't mean acceptance or approval".
Think of madame Goebbels then....
He-he....
Both are as you know Semites and both have Abraham as father, yet they are ennemie brothers.
And as brither feud goes, they are the most violent and unforgiving of all.
But you seems to be more reasonable...
No I did not mean that and after rereading me no wonder. I wrote badly but that is not the first time.
"Understanding anger and frustration doesn't mean acceptance or approval".
Think of madame Goebbels then....
I enjoyed both, although I thought Sophie Scholl was a better movie. It's rare to see such well-fleshed out characters portrayed so well. Have you seen it?
Cheers. Doug
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Complicit Constapo Talibangelical since MMIII
I found it engrossing and disturbing.Could not stop watching.The performances seemed real to me ,I'll have to watch it again because I could
swear Bruno Gantz was shrinking through out the film.
Later
Rich
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And an overblow at that...
You fall for your imagination...
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Complicit Constapo Talibangelical since MMIII
First he overblowed the part ( Hopkins did only a slightly better job ) secondly what he did to humanity was 100% evil.
And has a politician that is all what you have to count for.
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Complicit Constapo Talibangelical since MMIII
,
Complicit Constapo Talibangelical since MMIII
Well in her own logic she could not see a future in a new society without Hitler and his regime, so she choose the big departure.
Her fanatism was higher as other values.
But courageous in a certain troubled way.
please follow her lead and do likeise.
Now tell me, what did you get wrong in my post?
The frontiers between courage and cowardice?
That must be it.
But did you go that far...
a real thread of Nazism in your earlier post. Reread it. I AM CERTAIN it is a language\translation problem
If there is one thing that nobody could argue against me is that I am making any king of apology of anyform of nazism.
You should now that.
But with human you have sometime to start from scratch.
I reread and I meant that you have to be cold blooded to act the way she did.
It was, as I wrote above fanatism but she also had the gut to live it until the end.
SH did not.
.
Well if you have to elaborate evereytime with old acquantaince, what work you will have to do with strangers...
twisted "courage" in her act but it's dwarfed by the incredible savagery, brutality, and inhumanity of killing her own children.
Think of that for a moment.
To cold-bloodedly kill not just one but ALL of your young children.
That isn't courage in any sense with which I am familiar.
Single-minded fanaticism, yes.
The cruelest, meanest crime of which humans are capable, yes.
This parsing of a virtue to somehow include one of history's greatest monsters (Hitler did many things but never to his own family by his own hand) is disturbing.
Some clever arguments are better kept away from truly horrific subjects.
I suppose killing people in gas ovens is somehow to be lauded, too, for its wonderful efficiency?
Of course.
But you mean a kind of auto censorship is welcome.
Mostly you are right.
But I felt for once not to stick at.
Between consenting...adult...
merely were exercising in the tradition of Monsieur Descartes.
Would have really hurt...
Now, beyond Descartes it is merely a transfer of feeling.
I mean tying to get in the boots of Magda...
You who are against death penalty should know better...
I must see this film.
Nah, saying your enemy is insane lets him off the moral hook. I accept that bad people are capable of courage.I've read that Frau Goebbels was intelligent and sophisticated and her husband was one of the more realistic Nazis, not that he was in favor of other Germans being realistic. I have no trouble beleiving that, afterall plenty of the bad guys in American history were intelligent and sophisticated.
Of course I don't think our bad guys were as bad as the German's bad guys but the point is valid.
Well she did have courage. Hell, if nothing else Germans have balls.
I donīt see any reason to categorize Germans with courage.
A cliche.
They just are like all the rest of us.
No more no less.
They just had an education for many years, who catrated their will, hence the horror they could later produce.
"I donīt see any reason to categorize Germans with courage."
I do.
"They just are like all the rest of us."
There is no "all the rest of us". Cultures that prize courage and militarism can turn out more brave and militaristic people than cultures that don't prize those characteristics. Extreme examples would be Sparta and Zululand.
Culture, of course influence the people who are basically all the same everywhere.
Well now Modern time Germany is the culture that absolutely not encourage any militarism!
But on the contrary! And how.
And as for courage, Mrs. Merkel just stated for her New Year speech that German should stop living in a culture of look away ( no courage ) and start for a culture of " seing ".
Praise? No acknowledge.
To kill in cold blood your own children you need a certain dose of brutal " courage ".
Did I put the clock right?
to the point of choosing to die---even choosing that for your children. That act of killing them wasn't as bent as for the REASON. (Of course, the reality of what the Russians would do to them is the true impetus.)
Eva Braun was pretty much "disconnected" for the gay, frivolous, 'let's party' attitude she portrayed.
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Complicit Constapo Talibangelical since MMIII
They could have surrended to the US army.
No it really was the reality to live in a world without National Socialism and their beloved AH.
I always thought that Eva was nothing more than just a fanatical groupie. A brave disciplined neat and freshly washed German woman....
Blond and with long hair on her legs....
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