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In Reply to: RE: compared to what? posted by Jazz Inmate on January 20, 2008 at 13:39:27
You say NTSC looks bad but upsampling looks quite good. I think you mean upscaling rather than upsampling. Upsampling is what happens in audio when the sampling frequency is increased. Upscaling takes a picture with a certain resolution and translates it to a higher resolution for display on a high def screen.
If you've got a 1920 x 1080 display and you're watching a standard def NTSC broadcast, you're watching it upscaled. It has to be upscaled somewhere in order for the display to display it at full screen height, either stretched horizontally to fill the screen or with black borders at the sides. If the upscaling isn't being done elsewhere in a cable box or digital set-top box, or in your receiver, then it's being done by the display itself.
So what you're saying is that standard def TV broadcasts look worse than standard def DVD.
Obviously different quality upscalers are in use for your different inputs. I don't know what your TV source is but if you have the option of external processing for the TV signal you may get better picture quality by swapping the upscaling operation to a different component in your system.
David Aiken
Follow Ups:
I'm upscaling DVDs via my PS3, which looks quite good. NTSC broadcasts from the Tivo Series 3 don't look nearly as good. Note that the upscaling and stretching that the plasma is doing to make the broadcast fit on the screen is not doing any favors to the picture. The upscaled DVDs appear in a smaller area of the plasma and look best when it is not stretched to fit.Yes, as you point out I used the term upsample instead of upscaled which is incorrect. But it's essentially the same idea. The processing generates the illusion of additional data, but if you look or listen closely you can tell there is no additional definition in the picture or the sound, whether you're upsamplinga CD or upscaling NTSC.
-------------"I have found that if you love life, life will love you back." -Arthur Rubinstein (1887-1982)
I'm in Australia which certainly makes some differences (PAL instead of NTSC) but it also means I'm not familiar with things like the Tivo boxes which we don't have. We've got cable and off air digital broadcasts but Tivo doesn't sell any of its products here, at least yet.
So, pardon my stupidity but does your Tivo box have the ability to upscale and are you upscaling there or sending a standard def signal to the display? Whichever way you're doing it at the Tivo, change it to the other if you have that option and see which works better. You will get an improvement if the device that does the upscaling after the change has a better upscaling chip than the one doing it beforehand. If the signal is passing through a receiver and it has upscaling options you can try that also.
Stretching the picture doesn't help and I'd simply give that up unless you're worried about plasma burn in.
David Aiken
The Tivo3 is essentially a fancy HD DVR that delivers standard and HD broadcasts. It doesn't do upscaling and I mostly use it to watch HD content at 720 or 1080i. So any standard def images via the Tivo3, the plasma is automatically stretching 4:3 to fit the 16:9 screen and this doesn't bother me enough to change the plasma's settings. For one thing, I risk a different luminescence on the sides of the screen over time if I insist on watching all 4:3 content in the middle of the screen. For another, it looks crappy anyway, so why try to put a silk cap on a pig.
The NTSC image from DVD is another matter, and I do use the upscaler in the PS3 for that.
-------------"I have found that if you love life, life will love you back." -Arthur Rubinstein (1887-1982)
If the Tivo signal passes through a receiver and the receiver has upscaling, you may get better results with it but I somehow doubt it.
David Aiken
Much of the content from the Tivo is already 1080i, so my intention is to pass it unprocessed through the preamp.
-------------"I have found that if you love life, life will love you back." -Arthur Rubinstein (1887-1982)
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