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In Reply to: RE: Are Plasma sets fading away in favor of LCD ? posted by AbeCollins on June 29, 2009 at 19:35:00
Panasonic, LG and Samsung. This is Pioneer's last year in the plasma business. Panasonic is the largest manufacturer of plasma displays and will no doubt continue for as long as they can (as long as profits are there).
I still prefer the way plasmas display video. Since the technology is in part based on CRT technology (phosphors), it's more natural looking than the way LCDs generate a picture. And even though my plasma is now 5 years old, I wouldn't trade it for any LCD to date.
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I agree. I believe that plasma is easier on the eyes also (if you can control the screen refections). I have a Panasonic and it's great. Much better than the LCDs I have seen at Costco. I got the Panasonice Plasma at Costco.
No surprise. TVs on display at Costco don't do the TVs justice. It's gotten to the point now where it's more a matter personal taste rather than one being better than the other with all things equal. Plasma TVs do some things better than LCDs and vice-versa. It's much easier on the eyes to watch a movie on a good LCD than a plasma because you aren't looking at the light source on an LCD, therefore it's a softer image. Plasma's picture is more clinical because you are looking directly at the illuminated phosphor. They are like the metal dome tweeters of TV. Initially impressive, but after a while they can be a bit fatiguing.
LCDs don't look so good until they are properly set-up (just use the instructions on any THX movie like those from Pixar etc). Then they can look very impressive. Much less reflection too. Reflection is a TVs Kryptonite.
Costco uses Component cables to deliver 720p res, split from one source to 40 TV's.
Do the math
I think a lot of it is personal preference but based on what I saw, and remember seeing even a few years ago, LCD always had a bit of a flat pastel look to it vs plasma. Plasma, to me, seeme to have more depth in the picture.
As for attaining accurate LCD color, it also seems to me that you have to be dead center to the screen because moving off axis even a slight amount shows up as a shift in color. This was especially noticeable to me while watching a TV newscaster - or any talking head. Move slightly to the left or right of center and the skin tone changes. I'm sure LCDs have improved viewing angle these days but still not quite there in my opinion.
Additionally, I see some blurring on LCD when watching sporting events but I've read that some of the newer sets with faster refresh rates address this problem.
Of course Costco isn't the ideal place to compare the technologies but what I saw at Costco is basically what I see at Best Buy or anywhere else when comparing LCD to plasma.
The LCDs have less reflection and if I were to get a flat screen for the living room I would probably go LCD because our living is bright during the day. However, down in the basement home theater room, I am more inclined to go plasma. I can control the lighting and make it pretty dark down there even during daylight hours.
Motion is the biggest weak point of the LCDs that I have seen so far. I have only really looked at the Costco ones mostly.
I should rush out and buy a good plasma, possibly Panasonic, before everyone stops making them. I've read consistently good reviews on Panasonic plasmas across their entry thru high-end line.
I have yet to see the Samsung LCD screens that use LED back lighting. These are supposed to be pretty good, and cost more, but I wonder how they stack up to a good plasma of comparable size and price.
So lets see, I buy one last plasma to last me say 5 years. By that time maybe LCDs have truly caught up and make the switch to LCD 5+ years from now. ?? Just thinking out loud. ;-)
A repeat of the "cartoonish" effect I didn't like previously. This time it was "The Rock" on Dish Network. Some have called it the "Soap opera" effect where the picture looks like one (or more) scene(s) superimposed on a background scene. Some might call this a "3D"ish effect but I found it irritating. Great display for video gaming but the LCDs have never given me the illusion of "reality" films sometimes do.
It's remotely possible the LED LCD is just providing a more "accurate" (?) rendering of how the film was put together revealing all the warts and limitations of film making technology, but I prefer the illusion at home of watching the movie on film at the movie theater; LCD has yet to do that for me.
There are adjustments for the motion, you dial in the one that gives the least motion effect with the least "video tape" effect. Samsung calls the adjustments "AMP" and there are dual adjustments, one called "judder reduction" and the other "blur reduction". Many enthusiasts think the best setting is 10 on blur and 0 on judder.
When properly adjusted these TVs show none of the effect I think you describe. Not to say they look as good as film in a theater.
There are two kinds of Samsung TVs using LED backlighting. The 950 series uses LEDs behind the screen that are locally dimmed; the LEDs are in zones that can be turned totally off thus giving a super deep and dense black.The other type uses edge mounted LEDs and so of course there's no local dimming and no super deep blacks. Indeed, many Samsung fans think the edge mount LED TVs are inferior to those Samsungs using conventional backlights. Many think the B-650s and B-750s, which use conventional backlights, are the best Samsungs other than the 950s.
I have an A-850 and a B-650 and I prefer them to any Panasonic plasma I've seen and I looked at quite a few. The good Samsungs have very accurate color, more accurate than many Panasonics are tested and rated as having, and the Panasonic plamas have a fine noise texture I dislike.
Edits: 07/02/09
I haven't seen any plasma look as good as the top LCD Samsung's..including the Pioneer!
I sure liked the blacks and shadow detail way better on the plasmas (Kuro and Panny). In fact, I loved the colors on the Kuro.
The Samsumg LCDs have come a long way. But I prefer plasma. Especially for film based material.
I read that the LED lit LCDs although look sharp, are harder on the eyes (viewing fatigue).
I don't know why Panasonic would stop making plasmas. Also I learned that one of the cons of plasma, the high power usage is no longer so true. My 50" is rated at nearly 800W which concerned me quite a bit, but I measured the current w/ a Monster power conditioner and figure that average may be closer to 200W. I think that it uses similar or less power than my old 53" Pioneer Elite rear projection set. I learned that a black screen uses 100W or less when on, and a full white screen uses close to 500W max, but one never constantly displays a white screen. So the power usage is quite proportional to the picture and much less than anti-plasma people would have you believe.
I've been contemplating the same thing, for the same reasons. Would like to get another plasma for the master bedroom before they stop making them. Problem is, the plasma that's already in there refuses to break. Damn Germans and their over-engineering ;-)
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Ah yes, I remember the name from high-end CRT TVs but never associated Loewe with flat screens.
Loewe, like every other manufacturer, switched to flat panels early in this decade. They don't make plasma TVs anymore - just LCD. You won't find one in a US store, because they pulled out of the US market back in late 2004.
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