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Obviously a docu-drama which although quite realistic on the whole was somewhat spoiled by the preposterous theme of the richest country in the World not providing healthcare to it's citizens, unless they qualified for something called 'health Insurance', or they could pay thousands of dollars to the hospital.
Laughable I know but the actors were very convincing at times.
Today is a gift - that's why it's called the Present.
Best Regards,
Chris Redmond.
Follow Ups:
I loved the bit in France with the laundry where Michael sticks his fingers in his ears and says Lalalala - and then the next scene is a government worker doing the new born mother's laundry. Priceless - i almost rolled out of my chair laughing.
The US attacking France out of Fear that Americans might like the way the French live and what they have - not a bad argument at all. And the note that most governments in Europe are afraid of the people unlike in the US.
A little revolution in the US might get the power out of the hands of the top 10% who keep arguing for the American Dream - which very few will ever really live.
Michael's case that there are plenty of things already socialized, libraries, police, fire, education is also correct.
I see a world where the Police operate the same as the US medical system - it would go as follows:
Ding dong - Hi I'm officer Mike of the Miami Metro PD. I see that your 7 year old daughter was raped and knifed to death but I am sorry mam you have only paid for coverage XYZ and under your plan you only get one officer for 15 minutes - me and this conversation has already taken up 3 minutes of your allotted time. Now if you pay $197,000 then we will investigate your daughter's murder. You'll lose your house and car and live on the street but....
"But officer this is a heinous crime that deserves the attention of the police."
"That may be so mam but according to insurance company this is what you get. I'm sorry but I must go to your millionaire neighbor's house - she has the full premium - we are sending 30 cops and an undercover agent for the next 5 years because someone stepped on her prized roses."
"But officer - should this be based on need and the level of crime?"
"No it is based on money - I'm sorry you're lazy and poor but the woman next door who was born into a family of millionaire's and her daddy bought a wing of Harvard that allowed her in and then onto the best jobs - paid the money.
But officer this is crazy - the police should spend their time on the greatest need not on who paid the biggest insurance premium."
"You're time is up - it went one minute over - I won't arrest you this time lady. Sorry about the kid - I hope you paid the body removal insurance otherwise you'll have to pay $22,000 to have her removed. Have a nice day."
That is NO different than a medical system that does not operate 100% on the needs of the people coming into a hospital - it is every bit as absurd.
"Michael's case that there are plenty of things already socialized, libraries, police, fire, education is also correct."
To add to your example, what happens when the fire-service carry some kid out of a burning house suffering from smoke inhalation?
Does the ambulance have to check the details of their health insurance before taking them to a hospital?
Exactly what does happen if someone has an accident in the US and doesn't have health insurance?
What a state of affairs.
Today is a gift - that's why it's called the Present.
Best Regards,
Chris Redmond.
Well I can tell you a story. My friend's dad is quite wealthy but imagine if you were the "average person". He is a Canadian male around 50 and went on holiday to Las Vegas. In Canada you should buy travel insurance but sometimes they don't tell you about it but I always buy huge travel insurance when going to the U.S.
Anyway - he had a sudden heart problem not a heart attack but skipped beats etc. He went to the hospital - had three injection of some liquid - each injection cost $6,000.00 I hope it was liquid diamonds because that is truly shocking - 4 nights in the hospital, ambulance service and the bill came to over $50,000. I can tell you that that would put me into bankruptcy.
My friend's dad is wealthy as I say so he could cover that but wow.
With Canada's travel medical insurance the Canadian government will foot the bill up to about 2 million (which still may not be enough for all I know).
I don't understand the logical of someone who makes a million dollars a year after tax who could not be just as happy with $900,000? But what is more idiotic is that there are Americans who make about $30,000 a year who have no coverage or coverage that if they ever need major surgery will be deemed incomplete coverage - these are the people who vote against free medical - based on what logic? There is absolutely no good reason for any of the middle class to vote against a free medical system - the ONLY people who have a problem with it would be big business - who make a profit on their employees dying.
I suppose small businesses might have some issues but I looked at the proposal and it seems to me it would benefit most small business financially - and may help them not lose employees over a lack of care offered.
I think the main issue is that people get into black and white debates - Capitalism good - socialism bad - free healthcare is socialism therefore healthcare bad - I am picturing neanderthal man with a club. Of course the typical voter against doesn't believe in Neanderthal man - the bones are just a test of faith.
But hey it's up to the American public - I just wish an independent non propagandist well respected team on both right and left in the states would clearly and fairly conduct a report in easy to understand factual points about what it's all about. I think Moore was more right than he was wrong but he tends to take the best examples of things - granted he is using hyperbole to make the point and to be entertaining but unfortunately if you have a film of 100 facts and he is wrong about just ONE of them the detractors will throw out the other 99 even if they are 100% correct.
The treatment of firefighters and those who helped on 9/11 was also a pathetic act by their government.
It is genuinely a mystery to me how any proposal for free health-care could be successfully opposed, and how any individual could be shame faced enough to speak out against it.
Also, how the heck can drug companies be allowed to profiteer in the manner they do and basically take the p**s out of the public?
If Michael Moore told any lies in his documentaries I'm sure he'd be sued in an instance so unless anyone tells me otherwise I'm assuming he told the truth although of course he does have an agenda and will exaggerate to make a point.
Today is a gift - that's why it's called the Present.
Best Regards,
Chris Redmond.
...In the US, it is better to accept death (due to lack of funds) than it is to have life forced upon you by the gubment. Just another manifestation of the savage free (not) market capitalism we love to practice in the US.
To me If I were an American I would want it ALL. Isn't that even better than capitalism -- How about Socio-capitalism.
Have free healthcare, university education to PHD, free bus service, when you're sick you're sick - unlimited days if necessary, etc etc - AND have a free market system for all the "gravy" items.
With some effort it can be attained - unfortunately it boils down to party politics - even if Obama does something that a Republican president would do - they will still be all over him disagreeing with it. That's the problem - the notion that he's a democrat - I vote republican - therefore "everything" Obama does is 100% wrong. That's a problem
The partisanship you describe is indeed a problem in the US at the moment. Another problem is the fear and greed sentiment so prevalent these days. Yeah, you'll see short term spurts of charity such as with Haiti but when it comes to long term financial "sacrifice", "no-way, no-how" is the attitude. Personally, I'd be willing to see my personal income reduced by say 20% if it could help assure an overall, long term wellness of the nation thru a comprehensive, nationalized health care program, universal low cost post secondary education and so on. When I mention this to my friends, they think I'm nuts.
Overall, I believe the inability of the US to plan for the long term in vital areas such as health care and a sustainable economy will be its undoing.
Back to films.
d
I've been fact-checking the movie for the last half an hour and basically Moore has stuck to the truth.
Here's a reminder of the most relevant facts.
Today is a gift - that's why it's called the Present.
Best Regards,
Chris Redmond.
aren't so by choice. Lazy, drunk, drug-addicted, and criminal: that's our "poor." Yeah, even the toddlers already display all of those traits.
Poor by choice?! Including "toddlers" who display traits of being "lazy, drunk, drug-addicted"?!!!!
Sure, there are those who do play the system and pass such behavior on to their children, but if you're not being sarcastic to make a point (which I've totally missed), you're one amazingly ignorant asshole about the reality of the way society functions.
John K.
nt
Today is a gift - that's why it's called the Present.
Best Regards,
Chris Redmond.
"Lazy, drunk, drug-addicted, and criminal: that's our "poor."
I could argue it's the same over here in the UK and that does make up a large percentage, though on the other hand there's a lot of people been laid off work or the companies they worked for have gone into liquidation so there are genuine cases and plenty of them.
Laying that aside however, the list of ailments which would prevent somebody from getting health insurance seems preposterous, and just taking a controllable illness such as diabetes as an example would preclude millions.
It surely can't be the case that anyone with diabetes is basically up shit creek without a paddle if they have a complication due to their condition, can it?
Now because I know Michael Moore is a manipulator of emotions, I was mentally filtering through all the repetitive points he was making and the extreme cases which won't have been commonplace.
Even so, I can't imagine that any objective opinion of anyone in a developed country would not be quite frankly appalled at the lack of care available for those least able to afford it.
The sight of a woman being dumped by one hospital outside another was shocking, no matter if she was an alcoholic or drug addict.
If it's acceptable that this should happen because some individuals are deemed worth the effort, then fair enough but the US Government shouldn't try to convince itself that the US is a Christian country anymore.
It's a company.
Now I understand that Barrack Obama is coming under a lot of criticism for his proposed Health reforms which I'm assuming includes some form of free health care, and again I'm shocked that anyone could have any issues with this apart from the drugs companies who apparently have almost every politician on their payroll.
Probably far more to it than I can see, but from the outside it really does seem...shocking.
Today is a gift - that's why it's called the Present.
Best Regards,
Chris Redmond.
among the middle and upper classes but, because of their family and resources, they can continue on, i.e. treatment, leaves of absence, loans, allow life to be placed on hold.
Also, many offenders come from the poorer ranks and their incarcerations then keep them from finding employment upon release; society seemingly says they've paid their debt but it really ain't so. During their internment, their families also suffer and it doesn't take a Dickens to realize the ripple-effect. Keep in mind that many poor are jailed from drug-related offenses, the same kind that the rich and middle classes are exempt from or at best are remanded to treatment and care facilities.
Lastly, we have a 50% divorce rate in this country. The largest percentage of the poor at any time are moms with kids and NO male provider--- and a significant number of these women are divorcees with court-awarded alimony/child support but with no collections because of a huge class of male, the "delinquent dad." The women bear the burden of child rearing and are pejoratively labeled by conservatives whereas the dads skip all mention.
Any society also has a significant percentage of folks who are mentally ill enough so as to be unemployable; it doesn't take a very serious emotional problem to make a person undependable or ill-tempered enough to preclude any socialization on a regular basis.
Lastly, a capitalist society needs a 5% unemployment figure so that there are bodies available for growth and to keep the wages down. This isn't debatable, it is taught in Economics 101.
At any rate, it is interesting that in the richest country the world has ever seen, the most popular of modern presidents, Ron Reagan, made a career out of blasting the poor.
Yes it does strike me that single Mums (Moms!) would be the least able to afford healthcare through no fault of their own, and 'Sicko' really did elaborate on the facts which I sort of knew but assumed mustn't really be the case in the US as no society would put up with such a blatantly unfair system for so long.
Now I hear that Obama is coming in for a lot of flack for wanting to provide some form of free healthcare for all, and again as an outsider looking in I just assume it must be a small minority of higher-ups on the Drugs companies payroll giving him flack as surely the majority would welcome such a move.
Of course, I'd imagine that with their tentacles spread all through Congress, the drugs companies will be scare-mongering that America can't afford free health-care (when virtually every other country can) and that such health-care will result in massive waiting lists, poorer care etc when nothing of the sort has to apply if well implemented.
It truly is shocking that it's taken so long for a president to drive this forward, and shocking that anyone openly criticising such a drive isn't shamed by the public and pilloried.
Today is a gift - that's why it's called the Present.
Best Regards,
Chris Redmond.
Unfortunately, Obama really didn’t propose much of anything as far as health care reform other than charging Congress with the responsibility of drafting health care reform legislation. He proposed a general concept and has provided little or no leadership, and the resulting disasters that were drafted in the House and the Senate are nothing more than a list of individual proposals related to health care that will only make things more complicated, and therefore more costly and impractical. Except, of course, for the fact that nothing will get passed in Congress because the public is so afraid of “socializing” anything except for corporate bailouts.
Obama at no time has proposed any type of nationalized health care, and has backed off any proposals that might even seem like such a proposal. The majority of the US public seems perfectly comfortable with the current disaster because the majority of the people don’t really use the “system” much and have no idea how bad things really are, and won’t until they lose their job when they’re in their 50’s and realize that they can’t buy health insurance for less than $3,000/month and they will be headed straight for bankruptcy if they encounter any serious health issues prior to qualifying that awful socialized program, Medicare.
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