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In Reply to: RE: Lots of bluster and innuendo, but your assinine remarks about blatant lying is truly out of the blue. posted by Audiophilander on December 30, 2007 at 23:01:58
>> No 'Goober', what it means is that I don't have an agenda that supports one format to the total exclusion or elimination of the other <<But isn't that exactly what your de facto position is? Doesn't your monetary support exclusively go to the HD DVD format? Don't you attack me and Ole and others who try to point out blu-ray's advantages and domination of the next-gen DVD market?
Er...yes, that is EXACTLY your position. And when you say you don't have agenda it is, in fact, a blatant lie. You may not want to have an agenda. You may have even convinced yourself you don't have an agenda. But you very obviously and overtly DO have an agenda.
>> I don't support either format to the exclusion of the other, <<
Oh no? Where's your blu-ray player, then? How many BDs do you own? Why can't you even acknowledge that HD DVD has woefully less capacity than blu-ray? The answers to these questions prove that you, in fact, DO support HD DVD to the exclusion of blu-ray. The more you say you don't, the more you make a liar of yourself.
>> Heck, it wouldn't surprise me if SONY emailed a request for you to step down as their 'unofficial' on-line spokesperson! <<
Well it should surprise you.
>> Note: If you were a volunteer blogging for a political campaign you would've been given the boot already for jeopardizing the candidate's chances (even though in consideration of your political persuasion it would probably be a Red state rather than Blue!). <<
Yeah, i recognize that my posting style turns a lot of people off, but that's how I express myself. I just can't believe that supposedly intelligent people like you who care about audio quality and optical HD formats would go out and adopt a technology that offers 30 gigs capacity when a more successful format exists offering 50 gigs capacity, knowing that both formats will soon be competing with downloadable HD content. I mean, you must have rocks in your head to make that choice for one or two titles and a cheap Toshiba machine. And then to continually lie and say you support both while you don't, and you can't even acknowledge the critical element of the capacity issue? It's *really* weird, auphl.
>> What I'm in favor of is a dual format solution. <<
Then you haven't learned anything from the DVD-A and SACD situation. Here we had a superior format and an inferior one, creating confusion in the marketplace. The general public didn't know which to adopt, even if they were interested. Different labels and manufacturers aligned with different formats. Yeah, universal machines were out there, but it couldn't bridge the gap. Downloadable music came along and pretty much put an end to both.
If you can't see the very real possibility that could happen to HD video, you're not terribly astute. By advocating your "two format solution", you are essentially advocating intransigence among studios, manufacturers, consumers and, ultimately, death to optical formats. The only way to ensure that doesn't happen is to align firmly behind one format and support it exclusively and make sure studios and manufacturers follow suit so that the mass consumer has a clear upgrade path to HD. You support muddying and bifurcating that path.
>> How many times and in what language do you need to be told that capacity doesn't matter if it isn't used? <<
How many times and in what language do you need to be told that capacity does matter and is being used, and that HD audio (esp lossless) and video requires large amounts of gigs.
>> WOW! Talk about conjecture! Page was on board initially, <<
Link? Source?
>> Personally, it's reasonable to assume that the "lossless" drop-outs on the Blu-ray release <<
Are they only on the BD release? Isn't the same content used to produce both the HD DVD and Blu-ray?
>> are sufficient cause to withhold and perhaps reissue if the problem is corrected. However, we have your 'inscrutable' opinion to rely on and provide us with the deep insight that Jimmy Page probably threw a hissy-fit and pulled the plug because he wasn't sufficiently involved! How can anyone possibly think otherwise? <<
I didn't specify Page. I said Page/Plant have a long history of such hissy fits, and it wouldn't surprise me if they were the reason for the cancellation. Note that the HD DVD was yanked too. You read one post on one website and the ensuing circle-jerk thread and you think you know what you're talking about. You don't. While I'll be the first to admit I don't know the reason Warner yanked this title, I offered an alternate possible explanation--not for you to criticize (though you're welcome to waste your time doing so)--but because there could be any of a multitude of reasons for the cancelled release. We just don't know the reason yet. Warner has issued no such statement.
-------------"I have found that if you love life, life will love you back." -Arthur Rubinstein (1887-1982)
Edits: 12/31/07Follow Ups:
> > > "But isn't that exactly what your de facto position is? Doesn't your monetary support exclusively go to the HD DVD format?" < < <Is de facto anything like your de Nile, because anyone can play that kind of subjective opinion game!? If by monetary support you mean buying movies I like, I plead no contest; if you mean donations made to a one format cause, nope.
> > > "...you haven't learned anything from the DVD-A and SACD situation. Here we had a superior format and an inferior one, creating confusion in the marketplace." < < <
Comparing the audio format war to the video format war is a serious error because there are other factors to be taken into account with high definition such as the government mandated analog/digital changeover. The DVD-A/SACD war was over competing audio technologies that required 5.1 speakers to be fully appreciated as being superior to CD. Arguably the new technologies didn't better CDs enough to make the investment in surround speakers and associated gear worthwhile for Joe Consumer, and analog audio (LPs) still sounded better to most audiophiles.
> > > "The general public didn't know which to adopt, even if they were interested. Different labels and manufacturers aligned with different formats. Yeah, universal machines were out there, but it couldn't bridge the gap. Downloadable music came along and pretty much put an end to both." < < <
Downloadable music provides a convenience factor that most on-the-go younger listeners can relate to better than middle-aged audiophiles. Dual format SACD/DVD-A players did bridge the gap, but the prices took too long to come down and they had little impact because the interest in those formats never reached the threshold of mass acceptance.
> > > "If you can't see the very real possibility that could happen to HD video, you're not terribly astute. By advocating your 'two format solution', you are essentially advocating intransigence among studios, manufacturers, consumers and, ultimately, death to optical formats. The only way to ensure that doesn't happen is to align firmly behind one format and support it exclusively and make sure studios and manufacturers follow suit so that the mass consumer has a clear upgrade path to HD. You support muddying and bifurcating that path." < < <
Balderdash!
Of course anything can happen, but taking a "Chicken Little" approach to the format war isn't my cuppa tea. I'm convinced that competition will bring the price of both of these formats down, that includes the hardware and video, and push the technological advances. The lowering of prices is what will get Joe Public to accept one or both of the formats, as early adopters have done.
> > > "Are they only on the BD release? Isn't the same content used to produce both the HD DVD and Blu-ray?" < < <
You obviously haven't read the threads from those who have bought both. Yes, the content is the same and the lossless audio is fine on the HD-DVD, but there's apparently a glitch on the Blu-ray that produces drop-outs. One has to wonder if this could be a problem with Blu-ray mastering or the ability to utilize lossless audio; maybe with so much capacity John Bonham's drum whacks on Moby Dick just got lost in all that unused gigabyte space! ;0)
Have a Happy Blue Year (but don't drink the blue Kool Aid),
AuPh
> > If by monetary support you mean buying movies I like, I plead no contest; if you mean donations made to a one format cause, nope. < <Oh, cut the crap already. You support one format and one format only: HD DVD. Exclusively. I've read your take on many movies you gush over on the film forum. The Pirates films, for example. You like 'em a lot and there's no doubt that you'd buy them if they were on HD DVD. You are an exclusive fanboy and for much worse reasons than you think I'm a fanboy. The problem with you is that you're either too stupid or too dishonest to admit it to yourself and so it's no wonder you can't admit it to anyone else.
> > Comparing the audio format war to the video format war is a serious error because there are other factors to be taken into account with high definition such as the government mandated analog/digital changeover. < <
That affects TVs, auphl. It no way affects or mandates consumer's buying a next-gen DVD format, and if you read the business page of the NYT today, you'd see a very stern article that basically warns against adopting either format and claims that most HDTV owners are perfectly happy with DVD. You add into the mix new chips that Intel is coming out with, and a method to download huge amounts of data quickly and there is absolutely every reason to think optical formats are dead as far as HD films are concerned.
> > Dual format SACD/DVD-A players did bridge the gap, but the prices took too long to come down and they had little impact because the interest in those formats never reached the threshold of mass acceptance. < <
There was a $200 universal player fairly early in the game. It didn't help. You need to push one format and support it or there will be intransigence in the market and the formats will fail. The studios will need to aggressively manufacture and market a next-gen DVD format and start phasing out DVD if the optical formats are going to have a chance against MS's vision for downloadable HD films.
edit: and one more thing. I asked you for a link, an official statement from Warner or some other official source stating that, as you claim, SRtS was yanked due to the dropout. Not only did you link me to a page that doesn't exist, but the URL indicated that it was a blog. This is a serious problem with you HD DVD types. You get all your info from blogs and you think it's a valid source. You're fools.
-------------
"I have found that if you love life, life will love you back." -Arthur Rubinstein (1887-1982)
I did not state that my link would provide an official explanation of the reason for the withdrawal of the high definition releases. What I stated was that Jimmy Page was on board for the HD releases; you requested a link of the source. Here is the exchange to reboot your memory 'Dory':(my comment) "WOW! Talk about conjecture! Page was on board initially, ..."
(your response) > > > "Link? Source?" < < <
Another 'more official' source (Audio/Video News) has been linked in that post since you're having difficulty accessing the earlier blog entry that supplies similar information.
However, you also stated:
> > > "Are they only on the BD release? Isn't the same content used to produce both the HD DVD and Blu-ray?" < < <
Below is a link to testimonials that supports the assertion that the drop-outs are only on Blu-ray discs (or is it that only drop-outs apply as fan-boys for Blu-ray? I'm not sure which observation is more applicable at the moment! -grin):
> > I did not state that my link would provide an official explanation of the reason for the withdrawal of the high definition releases. < <But that's what i asked for. Your ideas are based on people who couldn't possibly know why Warner cancelled/delayed release of SRtS and asked for a link/source that could corroborate your idea. You constantly make assertions that you are not prepared to back up. When you do try to back them up, you link me to blogs. I'm not interested in that.
> > Another 'more official' source (Audio/Video News) has been linked in that post since you're having difficulty accessing the earlier blog entry that supplies similar information. < <
I don't see any link in the page you linked me to. Nothing official whatsoever. And if you did have a "more official source", you'd link me to that. You can't.
> > Below is a link to testimonials that supports the assertion that the drop-outs are only on Blu-ray discs! < <
If so, it's more evidence that Warner isn't paying attention to quality when porting over the HD DVD content to produce its BDs.
:o)
-------------"I have found that if you love life, life will love you back." -Arthur Rubinstein (1887-1982)
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